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Phil Gibson
Goo Roo
WA
'91 UZZ31 track bunky, '94 blk/blk UZZ31

Posts: 1602
Reg: 07-2005

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Monday, March 08, 2010 - 01:45 pm, by:  Phil Gibson (Sciflyer) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yep Ben CAMS racing classes aside from Sports Sedans like Andrews are pretty useless for these cars as i looked into it too just out of interest, luckily there are no shortage of sprint, hillclimb and other non wheel-to-wheel racing events where eligibility (and costs) arent a factor
Damian Ware
Goo Roo
Victoria
UZZ32

Posts: 1414
Reg: 10-2005

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Monday, March 08, 2010 - 02:21 pm, by:  Damian Ware (Frozenpod) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Phil Gibson wrote on Monday, March 08, 2010 - 01:45 pm:

CAMS racing classes are pretty useless for these cars




CAMs racing classes are useless for any form of budget wheel to wheel racing. The so called cheap budget racing classes are upwards of 40k per year to run mid pack with 7 events per year.

The only affordable budget racing class is Formula Vee and even then it isn't that cheap good second hand cars are over 20k and having a 500kg car with 30-35rwkw isn't exactly inspiring.

In other countries there are many budget racing one make classes which offer close competitive racing with very low costs.

The two classes from the UK that caught my eye in particular.

MR2 racing N/A MR2 with very minimal mods
http://www.750mc.co.uk/F-mr2.php

Locost clubman racing based on the book chassi with a 1.3lt ford engine.
http://www.750mc.co.uk/F-locost.php

These classes being very tightly controlled with very minimal mods are cheap to setup. Costs are about 5k for a cheap car plus 5k to get it on track roll cage, tyres, race seat, exhaust and membership, plus racing suit and helmet.

To run mid pack requires about 5k per year of ongoing costs from what I have read.
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

Posts: 2000
Reg: 04-2006

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Monday, March 08, 2010 - 07:09 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What I was getting at was the way CAMS legislates in such a way that imports are not eligible for IPRA, which is arguably the next step up from lapsprints.

There are a whole bunch of guys who have modified their daily past normal levels and run them on the track for run. The next step up would be to run against other cars that are essentially modified versions of street cars. 'Club cars' or later IPRA was once where you would go next. This class no longer exists because IPRA peaked in 1980something and hasn't moved on. Sports sedans was also an avenue but it got pretty exotic and therefore too expensive to get into- and not everyone wants to put a chev and transaxle into their car to keep up.

I think Sports sedans could end up being this category (once again) if they go down the road they seem to be looking at, that is multiple categories. This has IPRA and others with their knickers in a knot. The way I see it- if other classes want to ignore the grassroots enthusiast then damn them to obscurity.
Andrew McKellar
TryHard
NSW
Soarer Sports Sedan (well, nearly); '84 MA61 Supra.

Posts: 388
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Monday, March 08, 2010 - 08:57 pm, by:  Andrew McKellar (Toymax) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You'd be surprised how many "normal" cars run in or as Sports Sedans Ben. It doesn't have to be an exotic space frame Chev monster. There's plenty of scope to start out with a very low budget and improve on the car as time goes on. My one is costing about 1/10th of some others out there, but I'll still have plenty of people to race against. You don't have to spend tens of thousands to run each year.

Your car would make a good Sports Sedan, but like all racing categories, you will need that roll cage. And a set of slicks of course.

Improved Production is very popular, based on the current formula. No reason to change that formula when they have capacity grids.

The rules are put in place by CAMS, but only after input from the IPRA and other interested bodies. So CAMS bashing isn't necessarily putting your efforts in the right direction. Its the same with Sports Sedans and any other category - we put submissions to CAMS for new or altered rules, with arguments for why they should be changed.

Sometimes they change them, sometimes not. The current Sports Sedan rules are pretty damn good, and some minor changes have recently been added to enable the inclusion of even more cars (AWD vehicles). They also encourage the use of "different" cars:

"1.2 Defined Car: The basis for the vehicle, and name by which it is known, will be the body/chassis unit. The use of exotic and/or interesting vehicles as the Defined Car is encouraged."

That's out of the current CAMS manual. Allows for some freedom of expression I reckon. A car just like yours for example Ben.

There has to be someone in the NT with the knowledge to help you out with a cage, surely?
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

Posts: 2003
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Monday, March 08, 2010 - 09:51 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have asked around. It seems the guys who don't own their own fabrication business get them made down south.

Some of the cages I have seen are a bit, erm, agricultural. Aaron Mead has given me the name of a business, but I am leaning towards copying a cage as I don't want to have to pay for all the hours spent in the design/make/fit/adjust stage.

This way I can gather the bits, and put it all together as I can afford it cash and time wise. The track looks like it will be closing for the second half of the year, so I might do a Tim the Toolman and do it in the shed over a couple of months. I should be able to find a few mates who ar happy to help out- the club up here has been quite welcoming.
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

Posts: 2004
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Monday, March 08, 2010 - 10:36 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Andrew McKellar wrote on Monday, March 08, 2010 - 08:57 pm:

The only problem with your front spoiler is how high it is from the ground




agreed. At the moment it is as low as it can go and still get on and off the trailer. I am toying with the idea of extending it forward another 50mm and say 20mm lower by way of a removable extension that would curve back into the undertray to form a wing profile and thus local low pressure area around the front axle area. I read in the CAMS book somewhere about a minimum radius for projections. I think it is 15 or 20mm, so this would address that if it is an issue also.

I have also seen guys run an air dam, with a splitter under it and then another sacrificial air dam under the splitter to further keep air out from under the car. Looks weird though.

So many ideas, so little time.
Andrew McKellar
TryHard
NSW
Soarer Sports Sedan (well, nearly); '84 MA61 Supra.

Posts: 390
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Monday, March 08, 2010 - 10:50 pm, by:  Andrew McKellar (Toymax) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

CAMS Manual, Sports Sedan regs:

"3.5 Aerodynamic aids:
(i) The use of undertrays, fairings, or other aids to aerodynamic form (including aerofoils) is not permitted unless specifically provided for in these Regulations.
(ii) It is permitted to fit a spoiler or air dam on the front of the car such that no part of it is more than 100mm ahead of the original coachwork at any point.
The bumper must retain its original appearance and location in relation to the unmodified area of the coachwork. However, it may be integral with the air dam and surrounding coachwork."

"Air dam undertrays may be installed and used as an aerodynamic aid. No part of the undertray may extend further rearward than the leading edge of the front tyres and must be within the vertical projection of the vehicle, including modified coachwork (tyres must be inflated to a minimum of 1.8 bar pressure)"

Little bit more than 15 or 20mm to play with fella.
Damian Ware
Goo Roo
Victoria
UZZ32

Posts: 1417
Reg: 10-2005

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Tuesday, March 09, 2010 - 01:42 pm, by:  Damian Ware (Frozenpod) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Ben Lipman wrote on Monday, March 08, 2010 - 07:09 pm:

CAMS legislates in such a way that imports are not eligible for IPRA, which is arguably the next step up from lapsprints




I agree but IPRA has become a very expensive and competitive class that only suits a few specific cars and there was quite a few people on the band wagon before the rules were updated over the break that is should be combined with Histroics.

End of last year/start of this year they did make some updates to make it better for newer cars but from what I have been told it was a very small step and no where near big enough.

I think the class has its place but it isn't remotely close to budget racing, similarly with Sports Sedans where teams are building cars with 100k plus budgets.

PS IPRA control tyres are the first thing that should have been changed.

IMO we need some local racing classes that are aimed strickly at budget racing. Most successful classes around the world and in Australia for this type of class has been single make with very limited modifications.

The 944 Challenge and E30 classes have done this vey well but they are now nearly 30 year old cars. Parts are getting harder to find and they have become quite expensive to maintain.

There was not much wrong with the formats of the 944 or E30 class and they have been running the same class with great success for 10 years now. IMO the same idea with a new car ie early-mid 90's that will run cheaply with a good supply of second hand parts for another 10 years would be great.
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

Posts: 2006
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Tuesday, March 09, 2010 - 10:10 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Andrew McKellar wrote on Monday, March 08, 2010 - 10:50 pm:

Little bit more than 15 or 20mm to play with fella.




I though there was a minimum radius for the actual leading edge though. I was looking in the general requirements I think. I'll have a look later. At the moment mine is 6mm (because I used 12mm plywood).

Damien- what I want from CAMS (or AASA) is a category that is a stepping stone up from lapsprints. Somewhere to go after your modified daily weekend lapper has got out of hand. I'm not talking superlap, but a race series. I have no idea how you would keep it grass roots as it is natural to want to win, and as soon as it attracts any sort of attention, someone will come in with a bag of money smash everyone, and then you'll be spending serious money just to keep up. Drag racing seems to have a class for everyone, and there are a lot of guys who progress their cars 'up' through the classes over a number of years.

Superlap is just big dollar lapsprints, but I love the freedoms they have and the difference in machines. (not a dig at Superlap)

Anyway, back to the track car. I am now about to take a big step and install a serious cage. It should end up looking remarkably similar to Andrew's beast (at least the cage will). Basically the track up here closes after the V8's in June so I'll have 6 months where I can't do any serious speed events. Over the next few months I plan to assemble a bunch of parts for installation in the second half of the year.
Andrew McKellar
TryHard
NSW
Soarer Sports Sedan (well, nearly); '84 MA61 Supra.

Posts: 394
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Tuesday, March 09, 2010 - 10:52 pm, by:  Andrew McKellar (Toymax) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

There you go mate:

"Schedule F - Aerofoils and Coachwork

The following are the CAMS (and FIA) parameters regarding the fitting of aerofoils and other aerodynamic devices to cars.

1. For each automobile (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th Categories) coachwork shall be deemed to include all external parts of the automobile which extend above the highest point of either the front or rear complete wheels (with tyres) with the exception of units definitely associated with the functioning of the engine or transmission and the roll bar.

Any specific part of the automobile which has an aerodynamic influence on the stability of the automobile must be mounted on the entirely sprung part of the car and shall be firmly fixed whilst the automobile is in motion.

Neither the roll bar nor any of the units associated with the functioning of the engine or transmission shall have an aerodynamic effect by creating vertical thrust.

All external projections swinging in a horizontal plane shall have a minimum radius of 15mm. The leading edge of any aerofoil fixed to the front of the automobile shall not be sharp."

The part in italics is what you were talking about I think. The 15mm refers to anything swinging in a horizontal plane, which your spoiler isn't I reckon. The next part about not being sharp is what you need to adhere to.
Damian Ware
Goo Roo
Victoria
UZZ32

Posts: 1421
Reg: 10-2005

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Wednesday, March 10, 2010 - 01:21 pm, by:  Damian Ware (Frozenpod) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Ben Lipman wrote on Tuesday, March 09, 2010 - 10:10 pm:

Damien- what I want from CAMS (or AASA) is a category that is a stepping stone up from lapsprints. Somewhere to go after your modified daily weekend lapper has got out of hand. I'm not talking superlap, but a race series. I have no idea how you would keep it grass roots as it is natural to want to win, and as soon as it attracts any sort of attention, someone will come in with a bag of money smash everyone, and then you'll be spending serious money just to keep up. Drag racing seems to have a class for everyone, and there are a lot of guys who progress their cars 'up' through the classes over a number of years.

Superlap is just big dollar lapsprints, but I love the freedoms they have and the difference in machines. (not a dig at Superlap)




Ben I know what you mean and I agree.

I certainly think there is a place for a class like that as well and we don't have that in Victoria. BTW is superlap wheel to wheel racing or just against the clock?

I still think a budget one make class with control tyres and very limited modifications using a newer car than the 944 is good via class as well.

It would give people the option that turn up to the track in there street car before they get too keen or modify there car too much the option of buying a deadicated track car for a specific class or keep building up there own.
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

Posts: 2007
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Wednesday, March 10, 2010 - 09:07 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Superlap is literally lap sprints on steroids. They go out do three laps at full tilt and come back in. 5 Laps total. It is not wheel to wheel but there are usually a couple of cars on the track together but they are trying to set the fastest time, not physically get in front of each other.

I haven't been to one, but have seen some footage and read the stories. The cars are at the very extreme end of modification. It is the Aussie version of Japanese Time Attack. Other countries are into it as well, hence the 'world' event happening this year.

I would love to spend the day in the pits as the 'open' class seems pretty unlimited in modifications.
Damian Ware
Goo Roo
Victoria
UZZ32

Posts: 1426
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Wednesday, March 10, 2010 - 10:26 pm, by:  Damian Ware (Frozenpod) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Ben Lipman wrote on Wednesday, March 10, 2010 - 09:07 pm:

Superlap is literally lap sprints on steroids. They go out do three laps at full tilt and come back in. 5 Laps total. It is not wheel to wheel but there are usually a couple of cars on the track together but they are trying to set the fastest time, not physically get in front of each other.




We don't have that here but there have been a few cars at sprint days that are only 2-3 seconds per lap slower than V8 supercars, they would probably suit that class well.
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

Posts: 2010
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Thursday, March 11, 2010 - 10:27 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I practised making some pipe joins today using a program I found googling the net.

http://www.metalgeek.com/static/cope.pcgi

I made both 90 and 45deg joins out of scrap 38mm pipe. I used the templates generated by the calculator above and cut them out with an angle grinder with a 1mm cutting disc, cleaned up with a sanding flap disc. They fit nice first go but I am still getting the hang of the new welder. By the time I found the sweet spot I'd finished the joins.

I am strongly considering buying a pipe notcher for the consistency and repeatability required, but it is good to know I can get good results free hand.

I'll go an buy a heap of scrap pipe this weekend so I can get some decent practice.
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

Posts: 2014
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Sunday, March 14, 2010 - 11:11 am, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I spent $20 and got a couple of meters of scrap pipe yesterday. Unfortunately all I could find was 48mm gal pipe, but it does have a wall thickness of 2.5 - 3mm which is about right for my practice.

I knocked up some of the joints that are found in the roll cage. Cutting the joints is way easier than I thought, requiring a steady hand with a grinder, and a little understanding of how the joins will fit together.

The welding is still developing. I'll make a couple of really good welds, and then do a shocker. I need to work on this consistency, especially when it comes to welding 'out of position'. (I forget which way I'm angling and moving/or find my head in the wrong spot to watch the weld puddle) I'll come with practice. I should have an interesting collection of metal 'art' when I'm done. I might sell it to an art collector from Europe for a million euros.



Upload

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Leon Wright
Goo Roo
WA
4WD Hilux

Posts: 1148
Reg: 08-2006

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Monday, March 15, 2010 - 06:02 pm, by:  Leon Wright (Techman) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Starting to look pretty good at that!
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

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Monday, March 15, 2010 - 09:29 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It feels better. Next step is to do some welds joining flat plate the same thickness and then cut them open to make sure I am actually getting full penetration.

I am also lining up some experts to come and assess my welds before I tackle the full job. This is a long term project for me. I want to make sure I get it right, as fixing something once it is in the car is going to be difficult.

As the CAMS manual says "good looking welds do not guarantee a good weld, but poor looking welds seldom indicate good work" (or something like that)
Andrew McKellar
TryHard
NSW
Soarer Sports Sedan (well, nearly); '84 MA61 Supra.

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Monday, March 15, 2010 - 10:30 pm, by:  Andrew McKellar (Toymax) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

They look better than some of the dodgy roll cage welding I've seen over the years Ben. Keep up the good work. Email coming your way with details on this end of things.
Ali Saeed
Goo Roo
WA
V8 Limited

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Monday, March 15, 2010 - 10:44 pm, by:  Ali Saeed (Ali) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

hey Ben, when you perfect the art of welding, lets get a roll cage group buy going hahaha
Andrew McKellar
TryHard
NSW
Soarer Sports Sedan (well, nearly); '84 MA61 Supra.

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Monday, March 15, 2010 - 11:11 pm, by:  Andrew McKellar (Toymax) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Ben Lipman wrote on Sunday, March 14, 2010 - 11:11 am:

I should have an interesting collection of metal 'art' when I'm done.



Get them powder coated and sell them to CAMS to use as real examples of good and bad welds in roll cages
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

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Sunday, April 04, 2010 - 01:30 am, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Like most of us who work for a living, I found myself wandering around aimlessly yesterday.

I did a bit more welding for practise, but soon got tired of welding perfectly good steel into totally useless shapes. Looking around my assortment of 'bits' I found some Whiteline(superpro-?) polyurethane bushes I bought off another member some time ago, and a set of LCAs and figured I'd join the two in unholy matrimony.

After a quick search, I decided to burn the hard old rubbers out with a butane torch. Shoulda done that outside, as I then spent several hours cleaning up the mess.

Today I tried to fit the bushes, and having never done this I toiled at it for quite some time. I got the bush in, but could not for the life of me get the crush tube in. After much swearing I gave up and hit the suspension pages.

It seems I have early model bushes and late model arms, the difference being several millimetres in diameter.

SO to sum up, I made a godawful mess and achieved nothing. Hope everyone else is having a good easter...
Scott Wilkes
Goo Roo
Tasmania
92 TT Factory Manual, 70 HG GTS Monaro

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Sunday, April 04, 2010 - 06:43 am, by:  Scott Wilkes (Scottywilkes) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

be careful with welding galv ben, if you notice when you are welding you will get a greenish smoke/haze from where your welding.

The galvanise fumes are bad, they can make you very ill, so make sure to do it in a very open area with plenty of air circulation and wear a respirator

copy and paste ftw :-)

The fumes can cause irritation to the eye, nose and throat. The inhalation of excessive zinc fumes can place you or the operator over the PEL (permissible exposure limit) and cause metal fume fever. Ozone can also be emitted and prolonged exposure to ozone can cause lung damage.
Ben Lipman
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NT
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Sunday, April 04, 2010 - 08:31 am, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have been grinding it off, mostly, but yeah no problems with ventilation. I am in Darwin- it is always hot as in the garage so both roller doors and the external door are always open, and a fan running.

I might have to buy (or rent) a decent respirator when it comes time to weld the cage inside the car as I'll be in all sorts of funky positions then.
Dan McColl
Goo Roo
Victoria (The Nazi State)
Active V8 and the Beast.

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Sunday, April 04, 2010 - 10:44 am, by:  Dan McColl (Hoon) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Once you burn the rubber out, you then need to punch the metal outer of the bush out of the arm.

Can be done with a press, or an air hammer.
Ben Lipman
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NT
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Sunday, April 04, 2010 - 08:35 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah Dan. I tapped it out with a hammer and an old screw driver. Was pretty easy when the arm was still hot.

I dunno what I'll do now. Go and buy the correct size bushes, or pull the arms off the cars and do them with the bushes I have. There is nothing wrong with the ones on the track car, but the road car has a few creaks and groans coming from her suspension now. I was hoping to put these arms into the track car, and the track car arms into the road car so it was all done in a couple of hours, and on the cheap.
Dan McColl
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Victoria (The Nazi State)
Active V8 and the Beast.

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Sunday, April 04, 2010 - 09:51 pm, by:  Dan McColl (Hoon) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You could turn the bushes down to the correct size. Easy on a lathe if you have access to one.

Or if not and you wanna be cheap, put the bushes in the arm and drill out the hole to fit the crush tube.
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

Posts: 2057
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Sunday, April 04, 2010 - 10:00 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I hadn't thought of using the lathe- it's standing in a corner of the shed under a bunch of other crap.

Might do that if I can find the blades...
Bernard Smith-Roberts
Tinkerer
ACT
Soarer V8

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Monday, April 05, 2010 - 01:30 pm, by:  Bernard Smith-Roberts (Gaze) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Concentricity is reasonably important for those bushes.

I wouldn't suggest the drill method, just because it's difficult to maintain concentricity.

Lathe would be fine - depends on how much your time is worth. Sell the bushes on to another SC user who could use them, perhaps?
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

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Saturday, April 10, 2010 - 01:12 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The bushes are not real popular with members of this forum. Everyone tends to go for replacement OEM style bushes, with poly types pretty much shunned. I'll probably have a crack at turning them down seeing as I have them handy and can do it at no cost. I have some other stuff that needs doing on the lathe at some stage anyway.

The big news for the week is my cage is all bent up and ready to send to Darwin. All I need to do now is find a freight company who can do it at a decent price.
Andrew McKellar
TryHard
NSW
Soarer Sports Sedan (well, nearly); '84 MA61 Supra.

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Tuesday, April 13, 2010 - 09:44 pm, by:  Andrew McKellar (Toymax) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Ben Lipman wrote on Saturday, April 10, 2010 - 01:12 pm:

my cage is all bent up and ready to send to Darwin


That would explain why my car suddenly reappeared in my garage

Send me an email with the weight and delivery details and I'll try to get a courier for you.
Damian Ware
Goo Roo
Victoria
UZZ32

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Tuesday, April 13, 2010 - 10:17 pm, by:  Damian Ware (Frozenpod) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Ben Lipman wrote on Saturday, April 10, 2010 - 01:12 pm:

The bushes are not real popular with members of this forum. Everyone tends to go for replacement OEM style bushes, with poly types pretty much shunned.




All relative to the applicaiton.

For a track car plastic bushes are IMO preffered as they can offer less deflection under load and they are freeer allowing for faster suspension action.

For a street car I wouldn't use them, turn them down in a lath and see how they go.
Matthew Sharpe
Goo Roo
North Island
JZZ31

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Wednesday, April 14, 2010 - 06:12 am, by:  Matthew Sharpe (Madmatt) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Indeed, and a track isn't going to have as many ripples or pot holes etc. as the open road, which is what makes plastic bushes so horrible on a daily driver.
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

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Wednesday, April 14, 2010 - 04:47 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I had em in the Rx-7 and didn't really mind them at all. I think a lot of people get used to the plush ride in a Soarer, and grow to appreciate it. It was designed as a luxury car after all.

It is the damning of all those that are seeing the performance potential in these cars and select a different path that gets a little tiresome. At least there aren't twenty guys yelling 'clean your headlights' as much as there used to be.

Anyway, It looks like I have the freight thing sorted, and can expect the cage to be in Darwin some time next week. For the record I have gone with Transdirect based on a recommendation from a member.

On the down side, it looks like the track meet on ANZAC day has been bought forward to the 18th meaning I miss another one. The track is still closing after the V8s in June meaning there are precious few opportunities to set some good times before I pull the car apart to fit the cage. Glad I spent the hundred bucks on NAMSC membership...
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

Posts: 2085
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Thursday, April 22, 2010 - 07:08 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

SO we enter a new chapter. On the floor of the garage is a 62kg Jigsaw puzzle.
Upload


I ended up going with Transdirect to organise the freight. Cost about $160 and took 5 working days, exactly as they quoted. I guess you can't really ask for more than that.

I had planned to put this together inside the car in the second half of the year after Hidden Valley closes for maintenance. Unfortunately I was one of those kids who opened every present before anyone else was awake, and so the main hoop is sitting inside the car.

I am now thinking I can do this inside a month, and have it ready for the last track day on the 23rd of May. I'll need to see about organising a gas bottle for the MIG tomorrow. If that gets done by the weekend, I reckon I'll start...

There is a motorkhana this weekend, but after ringing all motor wreckers in Darwin I am unable to find a pair of wheels to use for thrashing around the motorkhana track. The semis got pretty cut up last time I tried using them.
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

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Friday, April 23, 2010 - 08:05 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I spent the day chasing down a gas bottle and now have myself an account at BOC and 4 cubic metres of Argoshield light in my shed. I welded up a bottle holder off the side of my tool box/welding trolley and then got everything set up for proper MIG welding. I ran a couple of test welds and was very impressed with the way they came out.

I set about welding all the mounting feet together and then doing the final shaping to get them to fit into my floor. I managed to get one of the main hoop feet into the car before the missus dragged me into dinner with some stern words about cutting and grinding on a Friday night...

When she isn't looking I'm gonna sneak out and start stripping the interior (again) in preparation for going nuts over the next few weeks. I am going to do a bit of stitch welding whilst I am at it. I figure I'll ruin the interior paint anyway.

Once I have something interesting to look at then I'll post some pictures. At the end of the day it is going to look like Andrew's except not blue. I may change the interior paint colour whilst I am at it. Silver might be a nice contrast to the black external colour.

I am getting the feeling this is going to get out of hand, as I am already eyeing off the windows and screens for a swap to perspex. After all taking them out is going to make it easier to weld and paint...
Dan McColl
Goo Roo
Victoria (The Nazi State)
Active V8 and the Beast.

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Friday, April 23, 2010 - 08:26 pm, by:  Dan McColl (Hoon) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

When the Argoshield light runs out in about a day, swap it over for Argoshield Universal. You use up the light so quickly.
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

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Friday, April 23, 2010 - 09:28 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Will do Dan, I guess. I had to rely on the BOC guys advice as I have no experience to draw on.
Dan McColl
Goo Roo
Victoria (The Nazi State)
Active V8 and the Beast.

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Saturday, April 24, 2010 - 12:02 am, by:  Dan McColl (Hoon) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/welding-gas.htm

http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=6867

Maybe useful for ya.
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

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Saturday, April 24, 2010 - 03:28 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I got the front feet in today, and have welded in the main hoop and front legs. The front roof bar is welded in, and I have just started to fit the roof diagonal. Once that is done, the rear legs and feet will go in. Then the front and main feet come out to drop the cage so I can weld the tops of these joints.

Had enough for today, as I have damaged my third member, and it hurts!
Costa Tsimiklis
TryHard
Victoria
386.2 rwkw Soon T51R or GT4094 :-O

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Saturday, April 24, 2010 - 04:38 pm, by:  Costa Tsimiklis (Driftshop) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Nice progress.

Most motorsport cages are TIG welded to get better penetration and a better weld pool. MIG is like a glue gun and can just deposit a lot of material on top of the metal, without actually fusing it properly.

Welding overhead will burn your cock..... be careful!
Dan McColl
Goo Roo
Victoria (The Nazi State)
Active V8 and the Beast.

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Saturday, April 24, 2010 - 06:11 pm, by:  Dan McColl (Hoon) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I've never had any issues at all getting full penetration with a mig.

Tig is a little more controllable, but mainly better for thin stuff or aluminium. Takes a lot longer though.
Andrew McKellar
TryHard
NSW
Soarer Sports Sedan (well, nearly); '84 MA61 Supra.

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Sunday, April 25, 2010 - 06:27 pm, by:  Andrew McKellar (Toymax) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Don't paint the interior silver mate. The bright sun reflecting off the surfaces onto the inside of your windscreen will drive you crazy and you'll miss apex after apex because you won't see them.
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

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Sunday, April 25, 2010 - 08:16 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Don't worry Andrew, my laziness has got the better of me. I looked at how much work that would be for no performance gain and binned the idea.

(To be honest I couldn't decide where the black should stop and the silver start, so I binned the idea as to hard and went back to welding.)

A can of black will sort it, and the aluminium door panels as well.
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NT
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car

Posts: 2092
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Sunday, April 25, 2010 - 08:19 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Oh, on the way home from ANZAC day I stopped in at Supercheap and bought myself a WELDING APRON. This item is highly recommended when welding above your head. I don't know when I'll next have sex, but I now have a new number '10' on the pain scale.
Phil Gibson
Goo Roo
WA
'91 UZZ31 track bunky, '94 blk/blk UZZ31

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Sunday, April 25, 2010 - 08:36 pm, by:  Phil Gibson (Sciflyer) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

lol

waiting for pics

...OF THE CAGE

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