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Gianni Matrogiannis
TryHard
nsw
SC400 V8

Posts: 222
Reg: 08-2005

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Wednesday, November 19, 2008 - 09:18 pm, by:  Gianni Matrogiannis (Gianni) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

hey guys took the car to wsid tonight to see what she can do after the tune. Unfortunatly the numbers were not impressive at all. the best that i managed was a 12.7 at 111mph.

To put this into perspective last time i ran the car i managed a 12.1 at 117mph, this was a year ago when the car was making 345rwhp. The only changes i have made since then is some wider tyres and a tune. the car currently makes just under 390rwhp.

Now my questions are, how much power can these boxes hold? I noticed that even though I ran 7mph less I was still at redline in third gear. Could the gearbox be slipping? how fast should the soarers be going when they are at redline (6800rpm) in third.
Daniel Clarke
Goo Roo
NSW
TT 2.5L 6 cylinder

Posts: 4214
Reg: 03-2006

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Wednesday, November 19, 2008 - 10:24 pm, by:  Daniel Clarke (Dieseltrain) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey mate, Nice to meet you finally :-)

Does your box still retain the Lockup with the convertor? Im guessing it has finally had the d1ck and is slipping. Only reason why you would lose 7mph !

Id say you need to speak to MIke and order that puppy :-) Then knock out some 11's.

The v8's have a different ratio than the tt's... I know in 3rd gear @ 6800 rpm with the convertor locked, it should be around 190-200km/h .

However, if the lockup isnt working and is slipping, you would have more rpm and not enough speed. IM guessing your RPOM should be lower than the TT's as the V8 has a longer ratio in the diff.

New box me thinks champ.
Adam Peterson
Goo Roo
Western Australia
V8

Posts: 1775
Reg: 04-2006

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Thursday, November 20, 2008 - 05:12 am, by:  Adam Peterson (President) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Gianni, VERY NICE ! ~ regardless of your previous run.
Gianni Matrogiannis
TryHard
nsw
SC400 V8

Posts: 223
Reg: 08-2005

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Thursday, November 20, 2008 - 07:05 am, by:  Gianni Matrogiannis (Gianni) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey daniel

Nice to finally meet you too mate. I always thought that the lockup in the converter only worked while cruising. At full power shouldnt it release?

Thanks adam but trust me its very heart breaking :-(
Scott Casey
TryHard
nsw
soarer v8

Posts: 158
Reg: 02-2008

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Thursday, November 20, 2008 - 09:45 am, by:  Scott Casey (V8soarer_1991) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

3rd rear @ 6800 is 218km/h


Upload
Khris Cox
Tinkerer
NC
SC400 supercharged

Posts: 62
Reg: 03-2008

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Thursday, November 20, 2008 - 02:33 pm, by:  Khris Cox (Kc95sc400) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Gianni,

Nice runs!

If you don't mind me asking...

Done any weight reduction?
Slicks?
What are you rwtq numbers?

I'm at 350rwhp and have only managed a 12.85 @ 108.5ish, I'd love to hit low 12's.

Thanks,

Khris
Gianni Matrogiannis
TryHard
nsw
SC400 V8

Posts: 224
Reg: 08-2005

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Thursday, November 20, 2008 - 03:35 pm, by:  Gianni Matrogiannis (Gianni) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Scott thanks for the info. from the looks of it the box is stuffed.

Khris not weight reduction mate. on the wsid weigh bridge it showed 1640kgs. the car was on normal street tyres. i dont know torque figures but i will find out
Daniel Clarke
Goo Roo
NSW
TT 2.5L 6 cylinder

Posts: 4215
Reg: 03-2006

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Thursday, November 20, 2008 - 09:20 pm, by:  Daniel Clarke (Dieseltrain) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Nope, UNder full power with overdrive turned off, it should still lockup in 3rd gear.
Khris Cox
Tinkerer
NC
SC400 supercharged

Posts: 64
Reg: 03-2008

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Thursday, November 20, 2008 - 10:57 pm, by:  Khris Cox (Kc95sc400) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Daniel Clarke wrote on Thursday, November 20, 2008 - 09:20 pm:

Nope, UNder full power with overdrive turned off, it should still lockup in 3rd gear.




Mine will lock up in 3rd with od off but it won't lock up in 3rd with it on, only 4th.

Gianni...

FYI, I'm on my second auto now. The new(er) trans still bounces on the limiter a little but not near as bad. Of course I shimmed the accumulators and raised the line pressure on the regulator.

Sorry, still curious..

Slicks? What are your 60ft times?

I'm fairly sure I can get my car in the low 12.6's, maybe even 12.5's. The 12.85 run was with a horrible 60ft, a good tenth and a half slower than my best 60ft. But man, I don't think I could pull off a 12.1.

You should easily be running 11's once the trans is sorted. Good luck and good job!

Khris
Gianni Matrogiannis
TryHard
nsw
SC400 V8

Posts: 225
Reg: 08-2005

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Friday, November 21, 2008 - 06:39 pm, by:  Gianni Matrogiannis (Gianni) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

hey khris

all my 60ft times are about 2 secs. i have never run with slicks everytime i have run except for the most recent i have used bridgestone s03 235/40/18s on my last visit i ran 275/35/18s kumho ku31s.

knris what boost are you running, with the power you made your car should run a better time. Keep in mind my soarer is a uzz30 so its lighter than the rest and i have coil over shocks which helped heaps with traction.

Did you just shim your trans or do you have a full shift kit, what stall converter do you run.
Khris Cox
Tinkerer
NC
SC400 supercharged

Posts: 71
Reg: 03-2008

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Saturday, November 22, 2008 - 02:10 pm, by:  Khris Cox (Kc95sc400) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

350rwhp at 8.5 psi. I also have an SC400. I have Supra shocks and struts. I do have traction problems but also have better 60ft times than you. I average mid 1.8's.

Something is not right. Trap speed calculators put you at 468rwhp at 117mph and 3750 (car and driver). http://www.rpmoutlet.com/dyno.htm
I'm a little lost.

Shimmed and adjusted pressure with both the cable and the adjuster on the valve body. 2800rpm stall.

Khris
Daniel Clarke
Goo Roo
NSW
TT 2.5L 6 cylinder

Posts: 4231
Reg: 03-2006

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Saturday, November 22, 2008 - 08:59 pm, by:  Daniel Clarke (Dieseltrain) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Khris Cox wrote on Saturday, November 22, 2008 - 02:10 pm:

Something is not right. Trap speed calculators put you at 468rwhp at 117mph and 3750 (car and driver). http://www.rpmoutlet.com/dyno.htm
I'm a little lost.




AMerican dyno's usually show about 15% more power than the Aussie ones... Which would make it about 398rwhp whhich woulda been spot on for that mph...

I think Gianni's box needs to be binned and a built one in its place :-)
Gianni Matrogiannis
TryHard
nsw
SC400 V8

Posts: 226
Reg: 08-2005

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Sunday, November 23, 2008 - 04:30 pm, by:  Gianni Matrogiannis (Gianni) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

does anyone know someone that has a dyno in the sydney eastern suburbs. i have a feeling i maybe also down on power. The exhaust place that fitted my metal cats told me they were having problems with them blocking up.
Cihan Aday
Moderator
etuner.com.au
JZZ30

Posts: 2768
Reg: 07-2005

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Sunday, November 23, 2008 - 11:38 pm, by:  Cihan Aday (Cihan) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Gianni, once over a certain power level for a while the clutches tend to hold the power better in the midrange but slip more and more as the revs rise. It can actually be very subtle, especially if you're running a centrifugal setup where boost is gradually climbing.

Time for a built box mate!
Gianni Matrogiannis
TryHard
nsw
SC400 V8

Posts: 228
Reg: 08-2005

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Monday, November 24, 2008 - 07:04 am, by:  Gianni Matrogiannis (Gianni) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

cihan

Thanks for your input. I just spoke to mike from MV Automatics. He said that the box should hold the power and that if top gear was indead slipping then i would have blown the box completly after 6 runs. is there any way to test the box when it goes on the dyno
Khris Cox
Tinkerer
NC
SC400 supercharged

Posts: 72
Reg: 03-2008

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Monday, November 24, 2008 - 12:04 pm, by:  Khris Cox (Kc95sc400) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Gianni,

Hey man, sorry to have been thread jacking. Just curious about your quarter numbers and what's different between the two cars. I'm might PM you a few questions if that's ok.

On your box. You might make a problem more obvious if you use the brake a bit while accelerating. Would put extra load on the engine and transmission. Or, if the dyno you are using can vary the load, you might be able to use the dyno itself.

Khris
Gianni Matrogiannis
TryHard
nsw
SC400 V8

Posts: 229
Reg: 08-2005

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Thursday, November 27, 2008 - 05:59 pm, by:  Gianni Matrogiannis (Gianni) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Just got the car off the dyno. made 312rwhp so its down a fair bit. the interesting thing is i did 178km/h @ 6700rpm, so according to scotts chart something in the driveline is slipping.

Tomorrow ill take the car to work and do a leak down test and compression test just to make sure the engine is 100% then ill install the original torque converter and take it back to the dyno.
Matt Petersen
TryHard
NA
V8

Posts: 352
Reg: 01-2008

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Thursday, November 27, 2008 - 08:29 pm, by:  Matt Petersen (Mattmannz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What gear was that in Gianni?

My recent dyno run had me pulling 178 at 5700rpm with a 4.1 diff.

If it's slipping that will affect your power output.

Matt.
Gianni Matrogiannis
TryHard
nsw
SC400 V8

Posts: 230
Reg: 08-2005

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Friday, November 28, 2008 - 07:11 am, by:  Gianni Matrogiannis (Gianni) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

matt

the car was dynoed in third gear. My diff gears are the standard 3.9 ratio it did 178km/h at 6700rpm so looks like something is slipping
Gianni Matrogiannis
TryHard
nsw
SC400 V8

Posts: 231
Reg: 08-2005

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Friday, November 28, 2008 - 05:30 pm, by:  Gianni Matrogiannis (Gianni) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

just check compression in the engine, it had over 200psi in all cylinders. also did a leak down test and less that 5% leakage, so all good there. Checked valve timing and that was spot on.

I rang michael from MV Autos and he calculated that i have about 12% slippage in the converter which according to him is normal.

So after all this all i know is that the engine is fine, the gearbox is fine but im still down about 70rwhp. What the F##k is going on
Matt Petersen
TryHard
NA
V8

Posts: 353
Reg: 01-2008

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Friday, November 28, 2008 - 06:06 pm, by:  Matt Petersen (Mattmannz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Given that you are over 1000rpm higher than you should be I would say that that is more than 12% slippage.

I don't know how much slippage a stock vs after market converter would offer but I would have thought that it should be locked at that point.

Matt.
Gianni Matrogiannis
TryHard
nsw
SC400 V8

Posts: 232
Reg: 08-2005

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Friday, November 28, 2008 - 06:34 pm, by:  Gianni Matrogiannis (Gianni) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

matt i just noticed that you are running a manual. that will probably explain why your speed is higher than mine.

I gave michael my wheel specs, diff specs and converter specs and he said that everything is fine interms of wheel speed. He did mention that maybe the converter may not locking up, so i should run a 12v switched signal directly to the clutch.

All this still doesnt explain the power loss.
Daniel Clarke
Goo Roo
NSW
TT 2.5L 6 cylinder

Posts: 4259
Reg: 03-2006

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Friday, November 28, 2008 - 10:00 pm, by:  Daniel Clarke (Dieseltrain) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I would try running the over ride switch for the lockup... Otherwise, its gotta be in the box somewhere.
Matt Petersen
TryHard
NA
V8

Posts: 354
Reg: 01-2008

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Saturday, November 29, 2008 - 04:56 am, by:  Matt Petersen (Mattmannz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Gianna I still have the auto in for now, R154 remote shift sitting on the garage floor at the moment.

When I did my dyno run I hit the speed limiter as I still have factory ECU.

Matt

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