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Joshua Olm
TryHard
Queensland
V8 GT LTD UZZ31

Posts: 242
Reg: 05-2007

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Tuesday, May 06, 2008 - 11:03 pm, by:  Joshua Olm (Iwannasoarer) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wondering what this noise is. Occasionally my Soarer has developed a 'bark' 'grind' from the starter motor kinda like the sound you get if while you have the car running you turn the key fully on as if to start the car.

Sounds like its coming from there anyway on start up. It doesn't always do it, but it's concerning that all of a sudden this has happened. Any help would be most appreciated. JO
Charlie Ters
TryHard
nsw
TT gone single :-)

Posts: 280
Reg: 01-2007

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Tuesday, May 06, 2008 - 11:45 pm, by:  Charlie Ters (Ul05st) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i am no help, but mine does that on some starts, where you hear a grinding noise as the car starts up (like rattling gears for like 1.5 seconds)... im pretty sure its starter motor orientated but... (im keeping an eye out for this, the second it becomes servre, then ill act :-) )
Peter Nitschke
Junk Filterer
South Australia
UZZ30 UZZ31

Posts: 9240
Reg: 11-2004

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Wednesday, May 07, 2008 - 05:08 am, by:  Peter Nitschke (Pen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The starter motor gear might not be disengaging properly from the ring gear?
Joshua Olm
TryHard
Queensland
V8 GT LTD UZZ31

Posts: 243
Reg: 05-2007

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Wednesday, May 07, 2008 - 07:44 am, by:  Joshua Olm (Iwannasoarer) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I thought maybe the same Peter but the sound is before the car 'starts' not after it's going.

If you try to start the car it will make this noise momentarily...turn the key back in to off position...try n start again...starts normal with no noise.

hmmm....
Peter Nitschke
Junk Filterer
South Australia
UZZ30 UZZ31

Posts: 9241
Reg: 11-2004

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Wednesday, May 07, 2008 - 08:38 am, by:  Peter Nitschke (Pen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Similar then, the starter isn't throwing the gear out properly to engage with the ring gear.

Either way, it could get more costly to fix if left to chew the ring gear.
Joshua Olm
TryHard
Queensland
V8 GT LTD UZZ31

Posts: 244
Reg: 05-2007

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Wednesday, May 07, 2008 - 10:54 pm, by:  Joshua Olm (Iwannasoarer) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

...ah...ouch Better look into it asap then. Damn just did front tyres and a power steering pump...what next lol
Brian Timms
Goo Roo
New South Wales
TT Soarer Goodness.

Posts: 1174
Reg: 12-2006

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Thursday, May 08, 2008 - 06:40 pm, by:  Brian Timms (Turbo_brian) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Peter has hit it on the head.

The starter motor has a spring in it, when you fire the motor, it springs the cog into the fly-wheel and it turns with the power of the motor.

If the spring is worn or gives up, then the cog moves purely on the spinning force of the starter motor, if it misses the flywheel, it grinds.

Time for a rebuild or new motor...

B.
Peter Nitschke
Junk Filterer
South Australia
UZZ30 UZZ31

Posts: 9251
Reg: 11-2004

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Thursday, May 08, 2008 - 07:05 pm, by:  Peter Nitschke (Pen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Long time since I looked at a starter motor, but I thought the solenoid also threw the cog out and the spring pulled the cog back when the starter disengages?
Brian Timms
Goo Roo
New South Wales
TT Soarer Goodness.

Posts: 1175
Reg: 12-2006

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Thursday, May 08, 2008 - 07:11 pm, by:  Brian Timms (Turbo_brian) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

probably, I didn't bother looking when I replced my starter, just bought a new one....

BTW, I have car parts for sale (hint hint, starter motor works fine).

B.
Matt Petersen
Tinkerer
NA
V8

Posts: 50
Reg: 01-2008

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Thursday, May 08, 2008 - 07:17 pm, by:  Matt Petersen (Mattmannz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

After having replaced a couple of 1UZ starters I would never put a second hand starter in. The time to remove and refit will exceed the cost of rebuilding the starter.

I got all the bits to fully rebuild the starter including a new pinion clutch for around $100NZ.

The gear reduction starters are very easy to pull apart and rebuild.

Matt.
Joshua Olm
TryHard
Queensland
V8 GT LTD UZZ31

Posts: 245
Reg: 05-2007

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Thursday, May 08, 2008 - 07:29 pm, by:  Joshua Olm (Iwannasoarer) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks for the advice guys. Will start looking into getting a new starter motor.
Brian Timms
Goo Roo
New South Wales
TT Soarer Goodness.

Posts: 1176
Reg: 12-2006

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Thursday, May 08, 2008 - 08:11 pm, by:  Brian Timms (Turbo_brian) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hmm, not sure with Uz, but the 1JZ is fairly easy to do, 4 bolts and 30 minutes :-)

My current Starter has been on my car 5,900kms since a complete rebuild :-)
Joshua Olm
TryHard
Queensland
V8 GT LTD UZZ31

Posts: 246
Reg: 05-2007

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Thursday, May 08, 2008 - 08:43 pm, by:  Joshua Olm (Iwannasoarer) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Brian if only it was that easy with the V8 mate. Got 18 pages of repair manual that I'm perusing right now that basically says it's not...sits in the valley between the cylinder heads. Gotta pull everything off to get at it. I'm guessing a 5 hour job if everything goes right. Have to order a fair few gaskets too so trying to work out how to track down the right ones.
Joshua Olm
TryHard
Queensland
V8 GT LTD UZZ31

Posts: 247
Reg: 05-2007

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Thursday, May 08, 2008 - 09:04 pm, by:  Joshua Olm (Iwannasoarer) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

...and further to this situation some help =
http://www.lextreme.com/starter.html

Ok, dreading what Toyota may charge me for a starter motor (after I check that my battery has the correct voltage) does any one know of any after market starters out there that are a direct replacement for an OEM one? Have read on a post one here that one of us was quoted $900 for one Will call Castle Hill but would prefer and after market one. After all if it does the same job why pay more.
Matt Petersen
Tinkerer
NA
V8

Posts: 51
Reg: 01-2008

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Friday, May 09, 2008 - 04:23 am, by:  Matt Petersen (Mattmannz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Joshua if you are going to check your battery voltage you need to do so whilst cranking the vehicle or with a big load on the battery.

Don't bother with a new starter, just get your one rebuilt.

It's about 3 hours to tear the top of the motor down then a couple of hours to put it back together.

Regarding gaskets, the only thing I would look to replace is the injector seals. Everything else can be reused.

Make sure you plug the intake holes in the heads as soon as you remove the intake to ensure nothing falls into it....

Matt.
Michael Keen
DieHard
nsw
soarer tt

Posts: 520
Reg: 10-2007

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Friday, May 09, 2008 - 05:54 am, by:  Michael Keen (Spoilt) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

you starter has two coils in the soilenoid, a pul in coil and a hold in coil, the pull in is which puts the pinion to ring gear, all the spring does it keep it in conntact until it get lined properly and then it pops in and the hold in coil is what keeps in there while cranking cheers.
Joshua Olm
TryHard
Queensland
V8 GT LTD UZZ31

Posts: 248
Reg: 05-2007

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Friday, May 09, 2008 - 06:19 am, by:  Joshua Olm (Iwannasoarer) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

awesome stuff guys really appreciate the input!
Brian Timms
Goo Roo
New South Wales
TT Soarer Goodness.

Posts: 1196
Reg: 12-2006

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Thursday, May 15, 2008 - 07:40 am, by:  Brian Timms (Turbo_brian) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wow god damn the V8's have another downside, that sucks.

I replaced my starter motor a few months ago with a freshly rebuilt unit, cranks like it's on steroids now...

Replacement in the TT's was basically D/C battery (important one here), then clip the cables off, remove the powerfeed cable, then undo 2 bolts, slide old starter out, slide new starter in, and do up 2 bolts, connect the wires in the same order you d/c them, reconnect the battery, and your done.

Having said that, I snapped a Unijoint doing mine, so it was off to super-cheap auto to get a replacement unijoint and a spare unit joint, and also a couple of socket extender bars because it was easier to work from further back.

Mine took 2 hours 40 minutes, including swear time, travel time, and browsing time at Supercheap.

B.
Sebastian Grant
DieHard
nsw
soarer TT

Posts: 953
Reg: 01-2008

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Thursday, March 25, 2010 - 04:01 pm, by:  Sebastian Grant (Saabg) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How on earth do you get to the top bolt? There is not enough room for a spanner from underneath and I can't even locate the starter from up top.
Brian Timms
Goo Roo
New South Wales
TT Soarer Goodness.

Posts: 1500
Reg: 12-2006

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Friday, March 26, 2010 - 06:41 am, by:  Brian Timms (Turbo_brian) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You use a socket set, a few extension bars, and a Uni-joint, push up along the transmission tunnel, and once you have these, the entire job takes about 10 minutes.

Use a Unijoint with the spring around it to keep it straight, otherwise you will be pulling your hair out.

B.
Sebastian Grant
DieHard
nsw
soarer TT

Posts: 955
Reg: 01-2008

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Friday, March 26, 2010 - 07:18 am, by:  Sebastian Grant (Saabg) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cheers Brian. I've never heard of a uni joint before, should be pretty easy with one of those.
Sebastian Grant
DieHard
nsw
soarer TT

Posts: 956
Reg: 01-2008

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Friday, March 26, 2010 - 01:46 pm, by:  Sebastian Grant (Saabg) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

^^^ I should be shot for that, I know what a uni joint is haha. The only problem was that I only have a 1/2 inch set so I guess I better get a 1/4 inch set and it should be quite easy.
Matt Petersen
DieHard
NA
V8

Posts: 724
Reg: 01-2008

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Friday, March 26, 2010 - 02:12 pm, by:  Matt Petersen (Mattmannz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I would suggest a 3/8in set as a minimum. The starter bolts can be quite tight, I would be suprised if a 1/4in set would handle the torque especially through a uni joint.

Matt.
Dan McColl
Goo Roo
Victoria (The Nazi State)
Active V8 and the Beast.

Posts: 2442
Reg: 07-2005

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Friday, March 26, 2010 - 07:19 pm, by:  Dan McColl (Hoon) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

1/2" fits fine.

If you need to buy a uni, I suggest a ball joint instead. Works kinda like a CV joint rather than a uni. Little bit stronger, but heaps smoother at weird angles and tends to stay on the bolt better.

I suggest a 600mm extension for your socket with a ball joint on the end.


Upload
Sebastian Grant
DieHard
nsw
soarer TT

Posts: 960
Reg: 01-2008

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Saturday, March 27, 2010 - 01:22 pm, by:  Sebastian Grant (Saabg) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cheers guys, I have a set of 1/2 inch sidchromes but there is so little room I didn't even bother to try to use the uni joint. I just tried it with the spanners. I'll give it another crack and make a tutorial while I'm at it.
Richard Crockett
TryHard
NSW
UZZ30 & UZZ31

Posts: 149
Reg: 07-2005

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Saturday, April 03, 2010 - 10:20 am, by:  Richard Crockett (Crock) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Matt -from where did you get the starter motor parts? Got any part numbers etc and did you rebuild it yourself?
Matt Petersen
DieHard
NA
V8

Posts: 725
Reg: 01-2008

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Saturday, April 03, 2010 - 10:45 am, by:  Matt Petersen (Mattmannz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I took the starter out and based on the part number on it Repco got me the bearings, brushes, and clutch.

Took about an hour to reuild the starter myself. Check the pinion on the clutch if you replace it to make sure the gears are the same....

Make sure you bench test it before reinstalling.

Matt.
Richard Crockett
TryHard
NSW
UZZ30 & UZZ31

Posts: 150
Reg: 07-2005

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Saturday, April 03, 2010 - 03:14 pm, by:  Richard Crockett (Crock) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cheers Matt - currently have a spare on the bench so will go from there.

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