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  Soarer Central * Track and Major Rebuild Car Projects * My crack at a responsive 300+rwkw single turbo build * Archive through January 12, 2014 Previous Previous    Next Next  

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Jason Cheah
DieHard
QLD
JZZ31 Lightly Modified

Posts: 620
Reg: 09-2005

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Monday, November 25, 2013 - 10:57 am, by:  Jason Cheah (Freaky) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Looks great Tai. Definitely interested in the progress in terms of spooling improvement. I am still planning and researching on QSV or EFR too.

That strut tower brace looks familiar...
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 1415
Reg: 04-2006

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Monday, November 25, 2013 - 12:54 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks guys!

I tried to keep everything tidy and will try to fit the OEM air filter and sort out a catch can to keep it looking stock(ish)

I got the heat shield from Autobarn, no idea if it's nasty. Pretty sure it's just high temp cloth with an aluminium coating. I have more shielding to do around the dump still.

Nice spotting Jason :-)

I am currently looking for a reputable tuner. I would like Cihan to do it, but I don't think it will happen. My other choice would be PITS or EFI Performance.

If you click on the link on the first page it has a full system to help you pick the right turbo for your application. As you can see from the pics it "should" come on boost around 3k..



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Ali Saeed
Goo Roo
WA
RSP JZZ30

Posts: 4546
Reg: 09-2007

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Friday, November 29, 2013 - 01:13 pm, by:  Ali Saeed (Ali) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What is your max PSI and where ATM? its not tuned right? How is the off boost response with the MT?
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 1420
Reg: 04-2006

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Wednesday, December 18, 2013 - 08:37 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sorry for the delay Ali, at the moment it's just running off the gate spring pressure and it seems to hit 16.5 PSI at around 4,000rpm. But it is SUPER rich and un-tuned at the moment.

As for the off-boost response, well at the moment it kinda sucks because nothing really happens in the 2-3,000 rpm range which is where most of the daily driving is.

I have the car booked in for a tune on the 8th of January and hopefully something is found. I can hear the turbo really come "on song" at just after 2,000rpm, but nothing really happens on the boost gauge until 3,500rpm

Compared to this evo which has less displacement and a larger rear housing, something isn't right.


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Ali Saeed
Goo Roo
WA
RSP JZZ30

Posts: 4563
Reg: 09-2007

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Wednesday, December 18, 2013 - 10:54 pm, by:  Ali Saeed (Ali) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Will be very interested to see the results after a tune. Using a boost controller will help boost ramp up and upping the boost might effect boost build up as well?
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 1421
Reg: 04-2006

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Sunday, December 22, 2013 - 06:31 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

After a little more trouble shooting today something definitely isn't right.. I have tested the actuator and it starts to open at about 22PSI (
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cOpRi8PrnEA ) but while driving I can only achieve around 16-17PSI at the intake and at the actuator

It looks like a HUGE boost leak, or a pre-turbine leak, it's really got me stuffed at the moment. I will pressure test the compressor housing all the way to the throttle body on Monday.
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 1422
Reg: 04-2006

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Sunday, December 22, 2013 - 06:41 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I also found a post where it looks like a guy with an rb25 has a similar issue.

The last pic is a response from Geoff at Full-Race who knows these turbos inside out.



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Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 1423
Reg: 04-2006

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Friday, December 27, 2013 - 04:56 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I plugged up the inter-cooler at the throttle body and the intake of the turbo and pumped it up to 20PSI and only found a few baby leaks which were fixed with a few turns of the hose clamps. Nothing major..

I checked the manifold for evidence of a leak of some sort.. All looks good..

Hopefully I'm missing something obvious and they spot it on the dyno.

Kinda running out of ideas as to what it could be..
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 1432
Reg: 04-2006

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Sunday, January 05, 2014 - 02:09 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

*small update*

I changed out the old plugs for new ones (BKR7ES-11) and gaped them down to 0.8mm.

I also heat shrank over my coils (3 layers), then a few layers of Kapton tape covered with self amalgamating tape and replaced all the broken plugs with new ones.

The dyno is on Wednesday the 8th and hopefully it all goes well.

If I don't get any better response I will probably either change the turbo over to the new smaller brother EFR 7163 with the mixed flow turbine, or 1.5J..

Fingers crossed it all hangs together!
Daniel Clarke
Goo Roo
NSW
TT 2.5L 6 cylinder

Posts: 7522
Reg: 03-2006

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Monday, January 06, 2014 - 08:27 am, by:  Daniel Clarke (Dieseltrain) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Good luck , hopefully they sort it out for you .
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 1433
Reg: 04-2006

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Thursday, January 09, 2014 - 09:57 am, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Dan,

Unfortunately they couldn't find anything wrong with it and it was a pretty disappointing day for me.

My aim was for 300 at the wheels with close to stock response and I have neither

I didn't have any ignition break down at 20PSI which means the heat shrinking worked, but my intake temps were pretty high at 65degC and there is hardly any timing in it because it would start to knock which means no power.

I am giving up for the moment, but the next on the list will be a new intercooler and I will probably try to sell the 7670 and buy a 7163.

The graphs speak for themselves..



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Kurt Atzmuller
DieHard
Victoria
TT`s

Posts: 604
Reg: 05-2011

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Thursday, January 09, 2014 - 10:15 am, by:  Kurt Atzmuller (Kurt) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Or just stick a 2j bottom end in there!
But yes that looks very laggy.
Thats a shame you've put a fair bit if effort into it.
What hp is that turbo rated too again?
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 1434
Reg: 04-2006

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Thursday, January 09, 2014 - 10:18 am, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

650HP... Not sure why it won't hold boost either...
Kurt Atzmuller
DieHard
Victoria
TT`s

Posts: 605
Reg: 05-2011

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Thursday, January 09, 2014 - 10:23 am, by:  Kurt Atzmuller (Kurt) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah i noticed that too. Your peak power is only at 16 psi. That would be similar results for a gt35 with a .82 rear housing i'd say.
What boost controller are you using?
Ali Saeed
Goo Roo
WA
RSP JZZ30

Posts: 4573
Reg: 09-2007

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Thursday, January 09, 2014 - 11:13 am, by:  Ali Saeed (Ali) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thats very disappointing
Robert Day
DieHard
victoria
v8 & TT

Posts: 644
Reg: 01-2007

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Thursday, January 09, 2014 - 11:35 am, by:  Robert Day (Lexsmaz) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi Tai,

Sorry to hear they couldn't improve things, Very disappointing for you ..

I'm sure you did it but when you put the Z bend in the actuator rod for the waste gate did you make sure the waste gate flap was fully seated afterwards & if so have you tried to maybe adjust the rod so there is some load on the waste gate flap too to keep it shut, just my 2 cents worth
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 1436
Reg: 04-2006

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Friday, January 10, 2014 - 12:20 am, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks for the comments guys..

I have a turbosmart e-boost street using the EFR's built in solenoid.

I can add some more pre-load to the actuator, but I lose some stroke length, and I can't understand why the actuator opens at 22PSI when I test it by itself (see video), but only makes 16PSI when on spring pressure when driving.

I can handle the lack of power due to knock and intake temps, but what really kills me is the response. It's exactly what I DIDN'T want.

This thing has the same compressor size as a 3076 and a lighter (albeit bigger) turbine wheel in a fully divided housing..
Daniel Clarke
Goo Roo
NSW
TT 2.5L 6 cylinder

Posts: 7527
Reg: 03-2006

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Friday, January 10, 2014 - 09:42 am, by:  Daniel Clarke (Dieseltrain) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Maybe a design fault with that turbo ?

But yeah a 3076r would probably have better figures with boost almost 1000rpm earlier .

Precision 5858 would be another option for insane response and power .
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 1437
Reg: 04-2006

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Friday, January 10, 2014 - 01:09 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Daniel Clarke wrote on Friday, January 10, 2014 - 09:42 am:

a 3076r would probably have better figures with boost almost 1000rpm earlier .




My point exactly.. But they should be similar!

I have been in contact with full-race and I have wired the gate shut to see if that changes anything down low.

Other than like you and Robert say, it could be a faulty turbo and the wastegate flap might not be seating flush for some reason.

I would like to try one of the externally gated rear housings to see if that does anything also.

And again, the 5858 is almost exactly the same compressor size as the 3076 and 7670. This turbo 'should' have 'insane response and power', that's why I chose it.

I know it has a large rear housing and turbine wheel when compared to the others, but it was designed like that to take advantage of the light turbine and respond like a smaller housing, but with more up top.

The 7163 has a smaller compressor 71mm vs 76mm O/D (7670 the 3076 and 5858) and can still flow out to 60lb, and the turbine is 63mm vs the 70mm in mine, the 60mm 3076 and 65mm of the 5858.

Add the new mixed flow turbine and the light weight wheel and the smaller 0.80 A/R, it should be bulls#%t good..

http://blog.perrinperformance.com/borg-warner-efr-7163-test-and-tune/



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Still doesn't fix my car tho
Ali Saeed
Goo Roo
WA
RSP JZZ30

Posts: 4576
Reg: 09-2007

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Friday, January 10, 2014 - 03:56 pm, by:  Ali Saeed (Ali) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I blame IWG and the flap not seating properly! I really am wishing thats it because I want one of these
Daniel Clarke
Goo Roo
NSW
TT 2.5L 6 cylinder

Posts: 7528
Reg: 03-2006

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Sunday, January 12, 2014 - 08:08 am, by:  Daniel Clarke (Dieseltrain) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah your right it don't fix it ... Why didn't you go the 7163 ? Sacrifice 5% power for outright over 700rpm response ?
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 1438
Reg: 04-2006

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Sunday, January 12, 2014 - 10:20 am, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I hope so too Ali!

The 7163 didn't exist, it's a new addition to the EFR family.

Wiring the gate shut didn't change the low end response.. Waiting to see what they suggest next.
Ali Saeed
Goo Roo
WA
RSP JZZ30

Posts: 4578
Reg: 09-2007

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Sunday, January 12, 2014 - 04:16 pm, by:  Ali Saeed (Ali) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

After reviewing various forum threads on supraforums, it seems that 7670 SHOULD hit full boost at 3500rpm on a 2jz...I reckon that translates to 3800+rpm on the 1jz.

The research also suggest thats the EFR turbos dont tend to make a lot of power on JZ platform compared to equivalent Precision or Garrett..
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 1440
Reg: 04-2006

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Sunday, January 12, 2014 - 07:46 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Could you please show me some of the threads Ali? I can't seem to find them..

What is full boost though? 12lb 27lb?

Ideally I would want the response that the perrin test shows for the 7163. 5lb @ 2k, 15lb @ 3k and 20lb soon after.

The question remains is there something wrong with my setup or not, and if I can get it to perform as is "should" or if I can get what I want with the 7670 and 1.5J or with the 7163 and 1J..

I think the baby intercooler the culprit behind the lack of power.

I checked the air temps with the PFC on the way home on Friday night and the minimum scale is 29degC and cruising home it steadily rose up to 60 degrees and did not change under boost, so I am thinking it's being heat-soaked and not the actual air temp..

Really missing my twins at the moment
Robert Day
DieHard
victoria
v8 & TT

Posts: 645
Reg: 01-2007

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Sunday, January 12, 2014 - 09:02 pm, by:  Robert Day (Lexsmaz) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey Tai,

What sort of "baby intercooler" are you running ??

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