| Author |
Message |
James Buchan
Goo Roo
Vic
vvt-i turbo 6 speed manual
Posts: 1958
Reg: 10-2008
|
The Invo's are great. Mine makes 325rwkw currently and the Invos just grip and grip. If you're really pushing it, you can get a tiny bit of wheelspin but not much! |
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!
Posts: 1647
Reg: 04-2006
|
Good to know! Thanks guys..
I was going to run the INVO's on the rear, but they didn't make one wide enough in the 17 inch.. |
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!
Posts: 1652
Reg: 04-2006
|
Big milestone, battery re-connected and ignition turned on with no smoke or blown fuses!
I had a very bad week when I was bench testing the ECU and accidentally connected it up momentarily reverse polarity :/
The protection diode is designed to blow a fuse (which I didn't have) and so the main power track became the fuse...
Sad times, but luckily nothing else died and it's back repaired for $150.
The new test rig has both a fuse and a reverse polarity diode in-line.
Lesson learned..
Anyway, all the vital signs are good. Air temp, coolant temp, MAP, RPM, oil pressure, fuel pressure looks good. Stepper motor moves, crank and cam sync.
Only issue is fuel pump which I will sort tomorrow hopefully.
Love the tacho sweep 
https://youtu.be/ELzoquaQN5c |
Clayton Carlyle
TryHard
NSW
v8 soarer twin turbo
Posts: 382
Reg: 04-2009
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Wow that's cool Tai, has it got a start up map installed? |
Brett Harrison
DieHard
QLD
JZZ30
Posts: 960
Reg: 09-2005
|
Looking good Tai, what's the plan when comes to tuning ? Can't wait to see how it runs for you. |
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!
Posts: 1653
Reg: 04-2006
|
Cheers guys,
No, I don't have a start-up map, but With VE tuning you don't really need one.
The ECU knows it's 2.5L and has 650cc injectors. You can pretty much set every cell in the base fuel map to 80% and it will run.
With the wide band 90% of the tuning will be road tuning and when it's all happy we'll dyno.
Myself and my friend Jason will be doing all of the tuning.
I sorted out the fuel pump today and set the base ignition timing so it's ready to start. |
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!
Posts: 1654
Reg: 04-2006
|
I put the Supra seats in too and made a heat shield for the clutch and brake master..
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Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!
Posts: 1655
Reg: 04-2006
|
After 7 months (felt like years) of hibernation she runs!
https://youtu.be/MZQxabYPuLk
(Please excuse the horrible phone microphone)
I cranked it without fuel until I had oil pressure and then enabled the injectors and she fired up first crank! |
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!
Posts: 1659
Reg: 04-2006
|
I gave the old girl a bath and finalised the loom after checking all of the sensors were working. Still all fits in the main loom.
The Supra Bilstiens seem to sit pretty nice and are much better ride quality than the king springs I had in there before.
The Supra 17's look like they were made for it.
I also took the liberty of replacing the old Pioneer amp with a nice new Alpine class D monoblock.
And the old Sony single din with a nice Alpine double din.
I've driven around the block a few times and to work and the short and long term fuel trims are working perfectly.
The main engine protection settings have been entered and confirmed working with the CEL activating if anything goes outside of limits.
I can't fault the Elite 2500. I haven't changed a single wire from the initial wire up.
I'll be road tuning a bit to see how the boost control goes with the dual port actuator and 4 port MAC valve, and then Dyno time again!
I was all set for the "All Jap Day" car show This weekend, but it's been postponed to the 19th due to rain.
If anyone is in the area (Nth Brisbane) you should come along and have a chat. |
Peter Nitschke
Junk Filterer
South Australia
UZZ30 UZZ31
Posts: 12854
Reg: 11-2004
|
Wow! Looks very nice! |
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!
Posts: 1664
Reg: 04-2006
|
Thanks Peter,
I'm pretty happy with the way it looks and is going at the moment. Definitely feeling a whole lot better about the situation than a few months ago..
I've been doing some datalogging and road tuning, and everything is still working as advertised with base fuel map O2 long term trim, idle control and boost control all doing their thing.
The one thing that doesn't auto learn is knock control.
I've done some low load low timing pulls to redline to establish a baseline background noise level of the new knock sensors.
They seem to be quite similar in response and track nicely with RPM. Once I get on the rollers i'll introduce some actual knock to see what my center frequency and amplitude is like.
|
James Harris
Goo Roo
QLD
GT Starlet
Posts: 3703
Reg: 07-2005
|
Looks the goods. Agreed regarding the rims |
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!
Posts: 1667
Reg: 04-2006
|
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Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!
Posts: 1672
Reg: 04-2006
|
Still progressing slowly.
I'm waiting on a radiator from Fenix before I do my dyno runs, so i've been tweaking other settings in the mean time.
I started to setup the boost per gear and found myself having to a A LOT of duty to the waste gate solenoid. Essentially as if it was the same actuator I had in there before and not the new dual port.
So after some investigation I noticed the bottom port (close direction) seemed to leak pretty badly. I contacted turbosmart and they asked me to measure the shaft as some units were undersized, and sure enough mine was. They have since sent out a new unit which does not seem to leak and should fix that issue.
I have also been researching cam timing a bit more which is very interesting and complex!
Essentially it all comes down to your EPR (engine pressure ratio) pre-turbo exhaust pressure v's intake manifold pressure.
The 'rule of thumb' was a turbo cam has little or no overlap due to high exhaust pressures (causing reversion) Old turbos can have drive pressures like 3:1 (30psi exhaust pressure to make 10psi manifold) and in this case yes, no overlap and you will essentially be pushing the fresh intake air out of the cylinder while both valves are open momentarily.
Many stock turbos are small and have restrictive housings and exhausts too.
Newer turbos (especially big ones) with large housings and exhausts can be treated almost as an n/a engine with decent overlap as the intake manifold pressure can be greater than the exhaust pressure, therefore no reversion. With this setup overlap can actually help a large turbo spool!
My Cams (BC 264's) have a Lobe Separation Angle (LSA) of 109 degrees and 10 degrees of overlap.
A 'typical' turbo cam LSA would be wider at around 112-114 degrees with usually less than 5 degrees overlap.
I started playing with the cam timing today reducing the overlap to 4 degrees and 0 degrees (retarding the intake cam and advancing the exhaust cam) and widen the LSA out to 112 and 114 degrees, and while I achieved more vacuum and a more stable idle from reducing the overlap, it seemed to negatively affect the boost threshold between 2 and 3,000RPM. Hmm
Here's a little blurb from a post I read:-
To increase overlap, you have to RETARD the EXHAUST, and/or ADVANCE the INTAKE.
To reduce overlap, you have to ADVANCE the EXHAUST, and/or RETARD the INTAKE.
Simple cam tuning rules for BOOSTED engines:
Advance intake and exhaust => more low-RPM power, less high-RPM power
Retard intake and exhaust => more high-RPM power, less low-RPM power
Less overlap => lower EGTs, faster turbo spool, less fuel
More overlap => higher EGTs, slower turbo spool, more fuel
http://www.supramania.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-64291.html
My engine seems to think otherwise.
I then went back to the BorgWarner Matchbot tool and plugged in my information again, and what do you know, it thinks that the turbo will make more intake pressure than exhaust pressure until around 3500-4000RPM.
It is hard to know how much of an effect it will have and I think i'll have to do fixed ramp rate dyno pulls to see the real difference, but I am enjoying learning about the finer points of engine tuning.
I think for my setup, it will be how much overlap I can have until it starts causing issues at higher RPM. The overlap period at high RPM is a smaller window than ad idle due to how fast the valves are moving.
I was thinking of installing an exhaust back pressure sensor and a EGT sensor to see what really happens. Maybe in the future.
Interestingly enough you can select Engine Pressure Ratio (EPR) as your 'engine load' axis with the Haltech as it is essentially a very accurate way of measuring how much air is moving through your engine. Gas turbine engines use it.
If you have read this far, congratulations. You are as nerdy as me.
Hopefully I have explained it well enough to make some sense.
Pics to come. |
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
SA
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car, plus a spare shell
Posts: 4032
Reg: 04-2006
|
I mentioned the difference between intake and exhaust manifold pressures as a consideration on facebook a while back and no one (except Glenn Munro) had a clue what I was talking about.
Exhaust manifold pressure can be so great it blows your wastegate open.
I am as nerdy as you. I read textbooks before going to bed every night. The last three were on turbo charger and turbo system design. |
Blake Gloyn
Goo Roo
manawatu
soarer JZZ30 TT
Posts: 1318
Reg: 02-2006
|
i am interested in this conversation, given what i was trying to achieve with the small factory turbo housings, and having a part in dyno testing the BC 264 cams in both a "stock turbo" soarer, and T-60 equipped soarer.
On my own 'stock turbo,stock cam,E85' car, the 325rkW was at 21.5 psi boost, 23 psi yielded 321rkW, 25 psi dropped the power further to 312rkW. So it would interesting to know if the compressors had run out of efficiency, or if the exhaust back pressure was the major factor... maybe both?
and in this situation would a set of high lift/ mild duration cams (Kelford 260 degrees were the recommendation) yield good gains , or would a external wastegate be of more benefit? |
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
SA
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car, plus a spare shell
Posts: 4033
Reg: 04-2006
|
It sounds like the compressor was outside it's efficiency range in your case Blake, but it could have been a combination of things. |
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!
Posts: 1673
Reg: 04-2006
|
Good stuff guys, i'm glad i'm not the only one who likes to delve a little deeper.
Blake, from everything i've read you need info. I have turbo shaft speed which is a good one to have, but i'd also like to see the actual pressures are to understand what's going on.
I'm almost 100% sure my waste gate gets blown open with exhaust pressure. Most internally gated turbo suffer from boost creep, where as mine is quite a large flapper and a very efficient gas flow path (enough to pass over 40% of the total flow) and drops off with RPM and the compressor is nowhere near maxed.
That's why I have the dual port actuator and 4 port solenoid now.
I like refining the setup and getting the most out of it, however after my mountain drive today it really felt like a big heavy car under 3,000rpm 
I'm starting to think the 1.5J is approaching.
I think the GE bottom end with it's bump in compression ratio make it feel so much lighter off idle and boost, and lower boost of say 18psi will probably yield the same power, but sooner with better longevity/reliability. |
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!
Posts: 1674
Reg: 04-2006
|
Some pics of the drive today
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Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!
Posts: 1687
Reg: 04-2006
|
Things may have escalated a bit...
The funny thing is though I am probably the only person in the world who builds a 1.5J and doesn't want any more power 
The mountain drive really highlighted the lack of low down torque and I started to think about buying an Aristo 1/2 cut and parting it out to keep the block.
That week a stock low KM Aristo vvti short motor showed up on eBay 1/2hr away from me and the rest is history.
I doubt I will do the swap this year, but it's nice to look at in the shed until i'm ready.
I also had a delivery from Fenix which will hopefully solve my higher than normal temps.
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Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
SA
Soarer TT manual, plus TT track car, plus a spare shell
Posts: 4041
Reg: 04-2006
|
Nice |
James Buchan
Goo Roo
Vic
vvt-i turbo 6 speed manual
Posts: 1967
Reg: 10-2008
|
Very cool. I too have often thought about doing a 1.5j, but I've come to the conclusion i'll just keep my motor as is and when the time comes, I will bite the bullet and fit a 2JZ. |
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!
Posts: 1688
Reg: 04-2006
|
Yeah, I also considered a straight 2J swap, but I already have a fair bit of good stuff in my head and a good manifold.
I know the 2J head flows better than the 1J, but I doubt I will be maxing out my head at my power goals.
Plus they are pretty bloody expensive and I'm keen to actually put a motor together! |
Sebastian Grant
Goo Roo
nsw
soarer TT
Posts: 2268
Reg: 01-2008
|
Nice work Tai. I have gone the 1.5j route myself with a brand new bottom end from Toyota. While I miss the sound of my screaming 1j the 1.5j blows it out of the park for drive ability. The off boost response is much better with the 3.0L bottom end. |
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!
Posts: 1691
Reg: 04-2006
|
Awesome Sebastian... Brand new! Wow! I though I was hard core
What turbo are you running?
I jumped on the dyno a few weeks back with the new ECU and the fuel pump pressure fell over at 14psi.. not sure why because it was fine with 24psi last time, but I did remove the fuel pump ECU and change wiring, so maybe I screwed up somewhere.
In the mean time I bought a small Arduino kit which hooks up to the OBD2 port that I wired into the haltech which has a little OLED screen that I can program to show different engine parameters.
I'm only new to coding, but it's already working pretty well.
https://youtu.be/A7JOtqj_09I
I might even try and mount it inside the dash for stealthness. |
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