Soarer Central: HID's Help

Soarer Central Electrical HID's Help

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Jose-Antonio Castillo
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Friday, June 08, 2012 - 07:09 pm, by: Jose-Antonio Castillo (Ahh_soarer)

Wayne Womersley wrote on Friday, May 18, 2012 - 07:13 pm:
I had Dremmel the globe holder Tabs, I guess you did too.

Not all HID kits are the same. The first HID kit I bought for my Soarer was from MTEC and the bulbs fit perfectly. These lasted about 2~ years or so before the bulb burnt out.

I then switched to a custom retrofit with all OEM parts (Lexus RX330 D2S projectors, D4S Denso ballasts and Philips 4300K bulbs). Now I haven't driven the car for the past two years but for the 5 years they've been installed they've worked like a charm every single time.

Wayne Womersley
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Friday, June 08, 2012 - 08:26 pm, by: Wayne Womersley (A49kidx)

Hi Jose,
First, let me make it clear, if you are happy with your HID’s, so am I, (whatever your setup cost you). Sounds like you have “been there done that” well good! I’m an old crying pensioner, with little income, but, I’m also happy with my supper cheap Chinese Kit. And I’m yet to find out how long the globes will last, ( I will let you know).
Now, I think we are all past it with Globe Types for our Soarers, both LB and HB. In the end, what ever fits, or what ever one is happy with, and works for them, I am also happy with.
Yes these HID kits vary in many aspects, but I would have thought there is a “Standard” re base tabs for 9005 or 9006 globes, be they Halogen or HID’s.
All I know is I bought my 91 Limited from one of the first and top importers in Melbourne in 2002, Sports and Luxury Vehicles in FTG. (but Hayden beat me and bought one in 97). I visit there a lot and they know me well. Apart from “everything else” I have bought several replacements top Halogen globe sets from them, all Phillips. And they just hand me 9005/HB3’s, telling me you will have to trim the tabs. Actually, Albert, Peter or Doug, don’t tell me any more, they know that I know what I am doing with the globes........
PS. Yes Jose, you have owner and driven more of these cars than me, so I guess you should know what you are talking about.
Cheers.

Wayne Womersley
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Thursday, June 14, 2012 - 06:20 pm, by: Wayne Womersley (A49kidx)

After doing a little research, I thought I might pass on a few things. This is in relation to our High Beam lights, the round inner ones, and Phillips Quartz Halogen ‘Globes’.
Before I go on, these HID globes, High-Intensity Discharge, I am not sure if the ‘glass’ on these globes is Quartz or not, as with Halogens’, but to be on the safe side I never touch it.
And HID’s are not good for the HB in relation to “flashing”, as they take a couple of seconds to come up to full brightness. also flashing them may reduce their life.
The Phillips X Treme Power 65 watt, is their brightest globe, but it’s colour is only 3200k. $42 http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/120785785562?ssPageName=STRK:MESINDXX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1436.l2649
The Phillips Diamond Vision 65watt is not as bright, but its colour is 5000k. $54.
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/PHILIPS-HB4-9006-Diamond-Vision-5000K-Bulbs-OZ-Seller-/120785778753?pt=AU _Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1c1f64b841

“Phillips Diamond Vision is a styling bulb, designed to deliver a bright white with slight/subtle blue tint, giving a light that is much closer to HID xenon It is not the best product choice if you are looking for performance; instead we would recommend Phillips X-Treme Power which will deliver 80% more light than standard.
Diamond Vision's aim is styling rather than light output.”

So it is your choice, use the Diamond Vision to better match your Low Beam HID’s, or the X Treme Power if you want the brightest and longest lighting.
I use HB4/9006 globes for the HB, but everyone to their own.

Greg Wyllie
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Thursday, June 14, 2012 - 10:18 pm, by: Greg Wyllie (Bearshead)

Wayne, thanks for the research, for the Low beams how do you think these Phillips Crystal vision

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/PHILIPS-HB4-9006-Crystal-Vision-4300K-Parking-/120785788815?pt=AU_Car_Par ts_Accessories&hash=item1c1f64df8f#ht_3561wt_922

Would partner up with Phillips X Treme 65w As the high beams, or could you suggest a better combination.

Wayne Womersley
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Friday, June 15, 2012 - 07:27 pm, by: Wayne Womersley (A49kidx)

Hi Greg
A few more Thoughts and Ramblings.
My wife has a current Mazda 3, the low beam lights are just so bright. Looks like High beam with a sharp top cut off. Probably OK if you’re in on coming Mazda Truck, sorry SUV, but I wouldn’t want to be in an MX5. And like everything these days , her “Owners Manual” covers EVERY Mazda 3 variant made, so I’m not sure if they are Halogen or what they call “Xenon fusion bulbs”
Anyway these 2012 Technology lights, and I’m not talking High End cars here, are way above of our Old Soarer lights.
Anyway , back to our Old Soarers, sticking with Phillips Halogen “GLOBES” (this is a British Colony, not a US state). The brightest globes are X treme for both the Low and High Beam.
But if you want to “Impress” on coming cars with the COLOUR of your lights, use Diamond Vision or even Blue Vision. But these globes will not give you the Brightness or Distance of the X treme’s. This is because a tungsten filament burns in the lower yellow end of the spectrum. Yes they can push it up but there are limitations. Increasing the voltage/current will raise the Kelvin colour, but this may also limit the life of the globe. So what is generally done to raise the colour is to colour the glass blue. What this does in effect is restricts the lower yellow end of the spectrum. So in effect the light will look whiter/bluer, but it has blocked maybe 30% of the globes spectrum and so 30% of it’s brightness.
I live in Melbourne and rarely get out to use the HB’s, but I do use X treme’s for the HB’s Anyway, who are you going to Impress with White/blue HB’s, you have to turn them off as they approach you.
A few people on this Forum have tried the blue glass globes and have said they were ‘dull and s**t’.
So for me, if I was using all Halogens, I would use X treme’s.
If using HID low beams, 6000k, I would still use X treme’s in the High Beams.
That set up is what I am currently running.

Wayne Womersley
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Tuesday, June 19, 2012 - 07:06 pm, by: Wayne Womersley (A49kidx)

Hi Peter, Following on from our past Communications, the 6000k Globes arrived today. As before, I have put one in the PS to compare it with the 4300k in the DS. I now like this 6000k HID globe, and will be sticking with these. As I said earlier, maybe one Manufacturers 6000k is different to another's. So if you want to buy these cheap Chinese HID's (as the Link above) I would get the 6000k 55Watt stuff. Like 'Everything' these days, if you don't like it after 3 months, just bin it, (that also goes for women).
PS. Each of us is free to make up their own mind and decisions.

Peter Nitschke
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Wednesday, June 20, 2012 - 02:45 pm, by: Peter Nitschke (Pen)

Damian Ware
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Wednesday, June 20, 2012 - 09:29 pm, by: Damian Ware (Frozenpod)

What colours were the insulator on the 6000k globes?

Wayne Womersley
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Wednesday, June 20, 2012 - 09:48 pm, by: Wayne Womersley (A49kidx)

Damian, I have read that note about insulator colours, but it has me st***ed. What Insulator. I have a 4300, a 5000 & a 6000k globe/tube from the same Chinese Man. They all have black bases, orange sealing O rings and the wire that runs to the top of the tube are covered in a brown insulating tube/material on the 43, 50. The 6000 is grey, but I Very Much doubt this is any sort of a colour coding. Just the colour of the HT tubing they had on hand.
I have no idea???

Jose-Antonio Castillo
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Sunday, June 24, 2012 - 06:44 pm, by: Jose-Antonio Castillo (Ahh_soarer)

Wayne Womersley wrote on Friday, June 08, 2012 - 08:26 pm:
Hi Jose,
First, let me make it clear, if you are happy with your HID’s, so am I, (whatever your setup cost you). Sounds like you have “been there done that” well good! I’m an old crying pensioner, with little income, but, I’m also happy with my supper cheap Chinese Kit. And I’m yet to find out how long the globes will last, ( I will let you know).
Now, I think we are all past it with Globe Types for our Soarers, both LB and HB. In the end, what ever fits, or what ever one is happy with, and works for them, I am also happy with.
Yes these HID kits vary in many aspects, but I would have thought there is a “Standard” re base tabs for 9005 or 9006 globes, be they Halogen or HID’s.
All I know is I bought my 91 Limited from one of the first and top importers in Melbourne in 2002, Sports and Luxury Vehicles in FTG. (but Hayden beat me and bought one in 97). I visit there a lot and they know me well. Apart from “everything else” I have bought several replacements top Halogen globe sets from them, all Phillips. And they just hand me 9005/HB3’s, telling me you will have to trim the tabs. Actually, Albert, Peter or Doug, don’t tell me any more, they know that I know what I am doing with the globes........
PS. Yes Jose, you have owner and driven more of these cars than me, so I guess you should know what you are talking about.
Cheers.

Hello,

Indeed I'm very happy with my retrofit. I've tried a few other different HID kits and to me, the MTEC was the best out of the ones I've had (all similar in price range). Hey, if a kit say $150 perform just as good as one that costs upwards of $300 then I'm all for it and would happily get a set for my fog lamps.

It'd seem that there would've been a standard rebase when the cars were complied but from what I can see is that no off the shelf HB4s will actually fit into a Soarer low-beam due to the base diameter being larger at about 22mm compared 19mm on the Soarer headlamp, hence the HB3 being the easiest fit. Don't know why it's like that, and only genuine Koito bulbs have been able to fit in correctly in the various Soarers I've been through.

Saying all that, my daily driver (UZZ31) gets by on Narva halogens and they're great.

BTW, my HID retro cost me around $300 excluding the RX3330 headlamps, which cost me a case of beer

Jesse Webber
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Sunday, June 24, 2012 - 08:02 pm, by: Jesse Webber (Jessewebber)

I just installed a set of these: http://bit.ly/LSbQaY

9005 , 5000k

Plug and play easy install, and wow am i impressed, for $30 I wasn't expecting much, but the colour is 100% white, no blue at all.

It'll just be a matter of how long they last, but if i get 12 months of out them for $30 i'll be happy, and it says it supposedly comes with a 2 year warranty.

I also run 5000k LED parkers, and will soon be installing H3 5000k Fog lights, and some Phillips diamond vision high beams.

It's nice actually being able too see at night now.

Damian Ware
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Monday, June 25, 2012 - 10:32 am, by: Damian Ware (Frozenpod)

Wayne Womersley wrote on Wednesday, June 20, 2012 - 09:48 pm:
Damian, I have read that note about insulator colours, but it has me st***ed. What Insulator. I have a 4300, a 5000 & a 6000k globe/tube from the same Chinese Man. They all have black bases, orange sealing O rings and the wire that runs to the top of the tube are covered in a brown insulating tube/material on the 43, 50. The 6000 is grey, but I Very Much doubt this is any sort of a colour coding. Just the colour of the HT tubing they had on hand.
I have no idea???

The burners are only produced by a couple of manufactures world wide. The are then put into bases by many different companies who then apply there own sticker/colour rating.

That tubing (insulator) is the true colour indicator used by the burner manufacture.

Yellow is 3000k, brown is 4300k/5000k and white/grey is 6000k, blue is 8000k, I cant remember the rest.

As per my other posts I have seen globes with 4300k stickers that were actually 8000k and others with 6000k stickers that were 10000k. This makes it very difficult to get what you want and what you have ordered.

Wayne Womersley
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Monday, June 25, 2012 - 11:06 am, by: Wayne Womersley (A49kidx)

Damian, Thanks for your informative post. It does seem you have looked into these HID conversions.

Thanks for the info on the colour coding on these Tubes. When I first read 'insulator', I was confused. But it's just the cover of the wire to the top of the tube. And yes, 'very' hard for any secondary assembler to mess with that insulator.

And I suspect you are right re there only being a few burner manufactures around the world. Maybe Phillips make their own and are maybe better, but each one of us has to weigh it up, $43 as against $150-$300. And how much better, 10 maybe 20%. Personally I don't do any 24 driving at Le Mans.

Cheers

Damian Ware
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Tuesday, June 26, 2012 - 01:21 pm, by: Damian Ware (Frozenpod)

Yes I spent a lot of time testing different HID kits. Brakes, tyres and headlights can make or brake any car.

Three factors need to be considered, ballast reliabilty, globe design which directly effects beam spread pattern and brightness.

Finding a HID kit which has all 3 isn't easy and a few years ago the cheaper end of the market did not offer this but they appear to have improved somewhat.

Wayne Womersley
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Tuesday, June 26, 2012 - 07:18 pm, by: Wayne Womersley (A49kidx)

Hi Damian, I think! we are together on this HID s**t. My, that must have cost you a bit of $ testing out different HID Kits.
1. Ballast reliability (they seem like Inverters to me, push 12-14v to around 23,000v, but little current) but the industry calls em Ballasts, (don’t want to confuse the Public). Anyway, reliability is a “time will tell” thing. Did some fail in a week or 3 years.
2. Globe Design. I thought you said there was only a few Globe/Tube manufacturers in the world, most likely in Third World Asia, and maybe Phillips, if in fact they are made in Europe. ( or is it like BMW, cars made in Spain and South Africa and who knows where else, Korea?
3. Brightness. Now, my understanding is that a 55watt globe should be brighter than a 35w globe. But many people are decrying the road ahead illumination with our Factory Soarer Low Beam set up of a 55 watt Halogen globe.
So why have two people on this Thread bought 35 watt HID conversion kits, when 55w are probably the Standard and readily available for very little extra. There are even 70 watt kits.
So yes in the end, one would ‘hope’ if one bought a $150 - 300 kit as against a $45 kit, it would Last Longer, have better Spread (but I’m not sure by what means), and be Brighter.
I guess it often comes down to ones financial situation, priorities, and self esteem.........

Damian Ware
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Tuesday, June 26, 2012 - 07:38 pm, by: Damian Ware (Frozenpod)

Only a few burner manufactures not globe manufactures. The burners and then turned into complete globes with bases and by many different manufactures.

I guess perhaps I should have been clearer about that but the way the burner is mounted in the base effects the beam spread pattern. Take a close look at halogen 9005 'metal' and you will understand why the beam spread pattern is poor with halogens.

35w is the power consumption, not the light output. Halogens waste a lot of energy with heat production. HIDs run very cool and produce a lot more light for the same power.

35w HIDs are a lot brighter than 100w halogens, but 55w HIDs are better again. I have never tried the 70w HIDs.

Wayne Womersley
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Tuesday, June 26, 2012 - 08:53 pm, by: Wayne Womersley (A49kidx)

Damian Ware wrote on Tuesday, June 26, 2012 - 07:38 pm:
35w is the power consumption, not the light output. Halogens waste a lot of energy with heat production. HIDs run very cool and produce a lot more light for the same power.

35w HIDs are a lot brighter than 100w halogens, but 55w HIDs are better again. I have never tried the 70w HIDs.

Damian, thanks for the lesson on Consumption versus Output.
Is that not what I said, a 55w HID is brighter than a 35w HID.
As I said, it must have cost you a lot $ to access all these kits..
Cheers

Wayne Womersley
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Tuesday, June 26, 2012 - 08:58 pm, by: Wayne Womersley (A49kidx)

By "Metal", do you mean the 'Tungsten' Filament.

Damian Ware
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Tuesday, June 26, 2012 - 09:42 pm, by: Damian Ware (Frozenpod)

I'm not sure what you said exactly but it came across as though a 35w HID might not be better than a 55w halogen.

Wayne Womersley
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Wednesday, June 27, 2012 - 09:10 am, by: Wayne Womersley (A49kidx)

Hi Damian,
No I did Not say or even imply what you said in your last post. I just said that in the aim of greater illumination, surly a 55w HID is brighter than a 35w HID.

Damian Ware
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Wednesday, June 27, 2012 - 09:18 am, by: Damian Ware (Frozenpod)

Fair enough.

Dan McColl
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Wednesday, June 27, 2012 - 04:16 pm, by: Dan McColl (Hoon)

Wayne Womersley wrote on Tuesday, June 26, 2012 - 07:18 pm:
Now, my understanding is that a 55watt globe should be brighter than a 35w globe. But many people are decrying the road ahead illumination with our Factory Soarer Low Beam set up of a 55 watt Halogen globe.
So why have two people on this Thread bought 35 watt HID conversion kits,

IT did sound that way, Wayne.

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