Author |
Message |
John New
Newbie NSW -
Posts: 1 Reg: 12-2009
| Hi there, Im interested in purchasing a soarer, but im not to apt when it comes to the variation in them. While looking through, the trading posts and car guides etc generally im not concerned with the amount of Km the cars. But when it comes to the age of the car I was just wondering if there were major differences in production that I should be aware of. The general age of cars im looking at are: 1991 (can only find a few) 1992 (seems to be the most common currently) 1994 (only seems a few) 1997 (seems to be more around than 1994 but by not that much) 1999 (a few around but soarers this young are getting out of my budget) Apart from the obvious, the newer the car the more reliable. Are there any advantages of soarers of certain years, that other year soarers dont have. Forgive me for the inconsistancy of my question. Thanks for your help John. |
Aaron Casey
Goo Roo nsw '94 jzz30 gttl, 2 mini's one supercharged
Posts: 1610 Reg: 08-2005
| basically the same main upgrades is front bar and rear light upgrades and 97 onward have the single turbo vvti 1jz there are a few little things interior not much though if you browse this site you will find most of the info here |
Matthew Sharpe
Goo Roo North Island JZZ31
Posts: 5005 Reg: 10-2005
| Guess the first thing to decide is which engine - V8, or Straight 6, then if you want a straight 6, turbo or naturally asperated, then if you want a naturally asperated 6, do you want VVTi, or if you want a turbo, twin turbo, or single turbo VVTi? Once you have answered those questions you can narrow it down a lot. Take some for a drive and see what you think. |
Tom Richards
TryHard nsw V8
Posts: 287 Reg: 08-2005
| V8 limited is a great touring car (plenty of grunt on hills etc)with lots of comfort and a few "gadgets." economy is good in the country (im central coast nsw ) and touring, but in sydney traffic fuel consumption doubles from the 620km/70l i get on the coast. On a trip ~ 650-680kms/70l. Twin turbo has good fuel economy if driven within reason. will kill the V8 off the mark, but i think the v8 comes back at high speed. to me V8 more comfortable, twin turbo quicker off the mark. reliability , both great |
Matthew Sharpe
Goo Roo North Island JZZ31
Posts: 5012 Reg: 10-2005
| And if you are a slow git like me, the 3 litre N/A is a good way to go. Great for my 240km round trip commute to work, dead reliable, and dead simple to work on. |
Mike Triggs
Goo Roo Western Australia 3.0GT G-Pack
Posts: 1439 Reg: 07-2005
| I'm with Matthew on the 3.0l n/a six. They are cheaper to insure (and maybe purchase) and are generally more economical than the other variants. There is also less to go wrong compared to the turbo model, and less temptation to put expensive "go fast" goodies on them. I'd be suspicious of "1999" models as few were made by then, often sellers put compliance date on, not manufacture date. The 1997 model on is definitely the pick of the models as far as looks go. Our n/a has genuine 177,000km up and in most respects drives like a new car. Like all Soarers the bushes need attention, in a lot of cases this is simply a rubber/age thing. It would be even worse on earlier models. If you are looking at the n/a, it's best to go for a late '97 as the motors went VVTi around August, prior to that they are the new shape but older motor. Not that there is anything wrong with the older motor, we had one for over two years and it was fabulous. One thing to look out for is that not many Soarers (at least the n/a ones) came with cruise control, which is one of the reasons we updated from the '95 to the '97. The later car is G-pack which gave us woodgrain (which, incidentally, is real wood, Birdseye Maple veneer), power seats and tilt, and cruise. You can live without power seats but cruise is a must. On pre-97 models cruise is limited to 108km/hr (but "fixable") on ours it's 112km/hr (fixable, but not nearly as easily). It can be retrofitted, but I guess not easily. Bear in mind that rear spoiler/wiper was an option as is the "premium" stereo with rear subwoofer. Our '95 was "pov pack" but had the premium stereo, the G-pack '97 does not. |
Steve Millward
TryHard NSW V8 Limited
Posts: 103 Reg: 07-2005
|
John New wrote on Wednesday, December 09, 2009 - 04:38 pm:Apart from the obvious, the newer the car the more reliable.
Not really. They are all old cars so you should look for evidence of maintenance before age. Properly looked after they are great. If not you can get into trouble. |
Callum Finch
Goo Roo WA Soarer TT & Corolla
Posts: 4611 Reg: 09-2005
| If i were to buy a Soarer again i would have gone for a uzz31 or 32. This is mainly because ultimately the Soarer is designed as a luxury car which the v8 models do better than the turbo'd models. (I dont have much experience with the 2jz ones however) The turbo cars are great if you are interested in getting stuck in to performance. Typically bolt on bits are cheaper to deal with on the 1jz setups compared to the 1uz's. But ultimately if you are after performance i would recommend you start with a different base car. These days either of the two luxo v8's are fairly cheap, although both can have high costs in getting them to run right. General rule of thumb is that the later models have better gadgets. |
John New
Newbie NSW -
Posts: 2 Reg: 12-2009
| Thanks for the replies guys. Im a P-plater so it'll have to be N/A, and I do a bit of city driving, so I dont think it would be to wise for me to get a V8. Im mainly looking at between the 94 and 97 model, thanks Mike for pointing out the changes between the two. |
Mike Triggs
Goo Roo Western Australia 3.0GT G-Pack
Posts: 1440 Reg: 07-2005
| No problem John. In the opinion of some, the '94-'95 tail lights look the best of all the Soarers, but I wasn't a fan of the nose. I didn't like the lower part with the useless lights (not that the expensive fog lights on the post '97 are any better). The lower part makes the car look dated, while in my opinion the post '97s look modern and fresh, to the extent that people are surprised how old our car is (and despite the fact that the number plate is "1997-EX" !!). It's relatively cheap to put the front bumper from post '97s on earlier cars, but the fogs are ridiculously expensive. Of course, pre- '97 noses don't have the small grille (which does very little) and if you want to fit a post '97 nose you have outlay for that too. I like the "grille-less" look personally. It's probably more important to find a good, clean car with some sort of service history that the actual year, as others have said, in the end, John |
Ali Saeed
Goo Roo WA V8 Limited
Posts: 1486 Reg: 09-2007
| i agree with Mike. the 97+ front bumper makes the car look great. oh btw you can buy some "dodge intrepid" foggies, which are ment to fit into the 97 foglights place. some peepz in the US are using them. |
John New
Newbie NSW -
Posts: 3 Reg: 12-2009
| Is it worth paying more money for a 97 over a 95/94, just for the VVTi alone?. |
Aaron Casey
Goo Roo nsw '94 jzz30 gttl, 2 mini's one supercharged
Posts: 1652 Reg: 08-2005
| ive seen a few people try do the dodge intrepid foggies and they werent happy with the fitment and how much you had to modify the bumper to fit it. sometimes you can find a front beaver cut for round a grand gives you the front bar, headlights and foggies and radiator etc |
Mike Triggs
Goo Roo Western Australia 3.0GT G-Pack
Posts: 1447 Reg: 07-2005
|
John New wrote on Monday, December 21, 2009 - 05:10 pm:Is it worth paying more money for a 97 over a 95/94, just for the VVTi alone?.
It's worth paying a little extra, John, for the more modern, fresher looks (not just the nose, there are big differences elsewhere, too). You're not guaranteed VVTi in a 3.0 '97 as VVTi didn't come out until August of that year, I think. Ours is September build, so one of the first VVTi that year. The VVTi was effectively a change for the '98 model (SC300 in US) but the shape was new for '97 (I think, maybe '96 for the turbos and last of the V8s)). There's nothing wrong with a '94 or '95, if the price is right, just be prepared for it to look a little dated. Many owners on this forum seem to spend money on upgrading the looks, either with '97 parts of aftermarket kits, mainly I guess because pre '97 are looking dated. Believe it or not, our '97 was cheaper than the '95 we had (exchange rates came into it) in part becauue ours was a "high mileage" car with 163,000km up (in Japan!). In 4 years it's crept up to 177,000km but then 2 years were on an 8km long island The 94-95 model run is to be preferred over the earlier models, unless the price is very good. The taillights are VERY dated on that model (many owners seem to be fitting aftermarket or '97 tails, but the '94-95 lights look fantastic and don't need changing). |
Kevin Trac
TryHard 2141.sydney.nsw JZZ30MT, JZZ31AT
Posts: 395 Reg: 10-2006
| I sent you a PM. There were 3 different 'shapes' of soarers. The 91-94 models have a slightly different front bar also to the 94-96 models. (and different foglights and such too) There was another update in 97 also |
Kevin Trac
TryHard 2141.sydney.nsw JZZ30MT, JZZ31AT
Posts: 396 Reg: 10-2006
| Also watch out at around the 150K mark, I think that is when some components start to fail. I just bought another soarer and the timing belt had cracks in it, and the tensioner and idler were on their way out. So make sure the 100K service is done too if you want some peace of mind |
Aiden Cheese
TryHard QLD Soarer jzz30
Posts: 289 Reg: 09-2009
|
Kevin Trac wrote on Monday, December 21, 2009 - 08:49 pm:I think that is when some components start to fail.
Personally i think its age more than KM's. Things like accumulators and stackers don't really get phased by distance. The engine itself runs well if its been well maintained for hundreds of thousands of KMs. The interior is almost totally up to the owner previous but also generally pretty obvious upon inspection. I'm just saying my 1991 100 000km soarer with brilliant interior and paint has a few non critical components wearing from age first. |
Damian Ware
Goo Roo Victoria UZZ32
Posts: 1243 Reg: 10-2005
|
Kevin Trac wrote on Monday, December 21, 2009 - 08:49 pm:Also watch out at around the 150K mark, I think that is when some components start to fail. I just bought another soarer and the timing belt had cracks in it, and the tensioner and idler were on their way out. So make sure the 100K service is done too if you want some peace of mind
Lack of owner care and maintenance nothing to do with the kms. Soarer will last 500,000km along with pretty much every other toyota if they are looked after. Some of the best soarers in the country I have seen have been here since 97 and have done well over 200,000km yet the good examples have nice clean undamaged interior great clean smooth running motors, good suspension and drive really well. Yet there are plenty of abused soarers with 100,000km on them that are falling apart. |
Rob Rojo
Goo Roo NSW TT
Posts: 3050 Reg: 12-2007
|
Callum Finch wrote on Saturday, December 12, 2009 - 10:26 am:The turbo cars are great if you are interested in getting stuck in to performance. Typically bolt on bits are cheaper to deal with on the 1jz setups compared to the 1uz's. But ultimately if you are after performance i would recommend you start with a different base car.
I disagree, name another car under 10K that has the looks and comfort of a Soarer and can be made to run low 12's for a couple of grand in bolt on Mods.
Tom Richards wrote on Thursday, December 10, 2009 - 09:29 pm:Twin turbo has good fuel economy if driven within reason. will kill the V8 off the mark, but i think the v8 comes back at high speed.
The V8's don't come back at all, the TT just keeps pulling away. |
Callum Finch
Goo Roo WA Soarer TT & Corolla
Posts: 4614 Reg: 09-2005
|
Rob Rojo wrote on Monday, December 21, 2009 - 10:53 pm:I disagree, name another car under 10K that has the looks and comfort of a Soarer and can be made to run low 12's for a couple of grand in bolt on Mods.
A couple of grand in bolt on mods sure, but how much in repairs to keep the car comfortable? The turbo models have no where near the same luxury features as available in the v8 models. If you are looking for luxury AND performance then i would not be sticking my money in an old Soarer that costs less than $10,000. It's self abuse. |
Rob Rojo
Goo Roo NSW TT
Posts: 3056 Reg: 12-2007
|
Callum Finch wrote on Wednesday, December 23, 2009 - 05:45 pm:A couple of grand in bolt on mods sure, but how much in repairs to keep the car comfortable?
My old Soarer was driven over 35000k's/year, ran 11 second quarters and not once did it break down on me and was still very comfortable to drive.
Callum Finch wrote on Wednesday, December 23, 2009 - 05:45 pm:The turbo models have no where near the same luxury features as available in the v8 models.
No doubt the V8 is more luxurious than than the TT but even the TT GTTL has more luxury options than most cars anyway and realsitically apart from Leather, Air Sus and EMV, what else is missing from the TT? (not including the crazy repair bills when these items fail)
Callum Finch wrote on Wednesday, December 23, 2009 - 05:45 pm:If you are looking for luxury AND performance then i would not be sticking my money in an old Soarer that costs less than $10,000. It's self abuse.
As above, mine was always reliable comfortable and pretty quick. What would you buy to meet the criteria for under $10000 or even $15000? Like anything, some will buy a car and have to spend a fortune to keep it running and yet someone might buy the identical car and not have a problem. Having owned 13 Soarers the only major work I have had to do it change a set of turbos. |
Mike Bradberry
Goo Roo Queensland V8 UnLimited
Posts: 1716 Reg: 07-2005
| Yeah, I guess you could buy the best V8 available at the moment and buy mine for $16,000. See 'Why would I consider that?' under this heading. |
Rob Rojo
Goo Roo NSW TT
Posts: 3058 Reg: 12-2007
| Mike, Yours is by far one of the best looking Soarers for sale at the moment, I just don't see the point of owning and running a V8 and that will get blown off by a stock 6cyl commodore or falcon in a straight line. |
Jose-Antonio Castillo
Goo Roo NSW Both Soarers
Posts: 1735 Reg: 07-2005
| At the moment I have a 91 UZZ31 and a 97 JZZ30, I used to have a 93 JZZ30 as well. 91-96 JZZ30 (sold): I found this car to be a little laggy down low (it had rebuilt turbos with steel wheels) but anything over 2800RPM or so it'd really kick in. It was a GTTL model so it had most of the bells and whistles (power front seats, velour seat trim, woodgrain etc) but still longed for leather. 97~ JZZ30 (current): Very strong off the line, feels like a V8 down low (more so like an LS1 than a 1UZ). One thing I hate about it though is the fly-by-wire throttle. Also an L-Package model, has most of the bells and whistles, just needs leather trim, LSD and a manual transmission... once I can get around the ETCS it'd be a fantastic car. 91~ UZZ31 (current/swapped): Refined, refined, refined. It's nice to have a Soarer where everything is working, especially on a car that is nearing 20 years old. Usual cracked front seats, power seats with memory, fully functioning EMV and TEMS air suspension. A great daily driver. |
Mike Bradberry
Goo Roo Queensland V8 UnLimited
Posts: 1718 Reg: 07-2005
| Rob, I think you'll find mine will not be beaten by a Falcodore either in a straight line or anywhere else. Read my profile and you will see it is not stock. We'll see maybe in February in any case as I might run it down the quarter. |
Rob Rojo
Goo Roo NSW TT
Posts: 3059 Reg: 12-2007
| Jose, I think this one was yours, It was laggy because it had the DD steel wheel turbos (Ebay specials) which actually have less fins on the compressor side than the factory turbos.
|
Rob Rojo
Goo Roo NSW TT
Posts: 3060 Reg: 12-2007
|
Mike Bradberry wrote on Wednesday, December 23, 2009 - 10:19 pm:Rob, I think you'll find mine will not be beaten by a Falcodore either in a straight line or anywhere else. Read my profile and you will see it is not stock. We'll see maybe in February in any case as I might run it down the quarter.
Sorry Mike I should have written stock V8 Soarer as I wasn't referring to you car just the V8's in general but either way even with the mods I still think I will be a close race. Stock 6cyl falcons now run low 15's which is a far bit quicker than a stock V8 Soarer. Any idea what power yours is making now? |
Mike Triggs
Goo Roo Western Australia 3.0GT G-Pack
Posts: 1448 Reg: 07-2005
| I think we're getting off the point a little here, as John suggested he didn't want a V8 and can't buy a turbo anyway. |
Mike Bradberry
Goo Roo Queensland V8 UnLimited
Posts: 1722 Reg: 07-2005
| Mike, I don't think John said he didn't want a V8, but thought it unwise to buy one. Maybe because of the fuel consumption in city traffic. Rob, my car puts out 158kws at the rear wheels on a cool day. |
Ali Saeed
Goo Roo WA V8 Limited
Posts: 1541 Reg: 09-2007
| i dont think it matters how fast your car is. legally you can only do 110 |
Rob Rojo
Goo Roo NSW TT
Posts: 3061 Reg: 12-2007
| Says the V8 owner. |
Ali Saeed
Goo Roo WA V8 Limited
Posts: 1544 Reg: 09-2007
| last i checked the v8 was the superior model ;) |
Rob Rojo
Goo Roo NSW TT
Posts: 3062 Reg: 12-2007
| I guess it is if you class superior as heavier, slower, less economical and more expensive to repair but it does have leather and a nice ride (when the air sus works). |
Ali Saeed
Goo Roo WA V8 Limited
Posts: 1546 Reg: 09-2007
| opinions opinions. last i checked how the manufacturers ranked their models, the v8's were superior. heavier: its all a bloody myth. only the 32s are heavier. a GTTL high spec TT would be exactly the same weight as a limited v8. the v8 engine is actually lighter.. slower: yes because speed wasnt the no.1 goal of the manufacturer when it came to the v8s less economical: lol it all depends on how you drive the car. i betchya most TT drivers would be getting higher fuel consumption than the v8s, cause we are slower.. more expensive to repair: cant say a lot about this because nothing on mine is broken...better ask Ty how he feels about his TT though...probably the only reason TT's might be cheaper to repair is because there seems to be a fkton of them around |
David Vaughan
Goo Roo Relaxed, but no provincial. IS300
Posts: 4763 Reg: 07-2005
|
Rob Rojo wrote on Thursday, December 24, 2009 - 04:58 pm:I guess it is if you class superior as heavier, slower, less economical and more expensive to repair but it does have leather and a nice ride (when the air sus works).
Jeez, it must be a pain, Rob, knowing all that and yet, knowing it is superior. |
Rob Rojo
Goo Roo NSW TT
Posts: 3063 Reg: 12-2007
| The V8's on paper were superior but in real world the TT is less troublesome, cheaper to run and out performs the V8 easily and now being anywhere from 10-20 years old the luxury options fitted to the V8 limited such as EMV, Air sus etc seem to be the most common problems and are also very expensive to fix. Regarding the weight the pov pack TT (1560kg) is lighter than the pov pack V8 (1590kg) and the GTTL is also lighter than the limited V8. As far as economy goes I would average around 600k's per tank with a mix of city and freeway driving and over 820k's to one tank from Melbourne to Sydney, whereas all four of the V8's I owned were closer to 500k's per tank or worse. I can guarantee you V8's are more expensive to repair. Even changing a set of plugs in a V8 will work out almost double the cost off the TT if you can't do it yourself. The cost of replacing one air strut in a V8 you could replace all 4 on a TT and still have enough change to fill the tank. I am pretty sure there is more V8's on the market at the moment than TT's. Anyway I do like the V8's and have owned a few of them, they were a great comfortable car but the lack of power was disappointing. An extra 50kw's would have made it a much more desirable car. And regarding Ty's car he may just be very unlucky or just not be doing things the right way. |
Rob Rojo
Goo Roo NSW TT
Posts: 3064 Reg: 12-2007
|
David Vaughan wrote on Thursday, December 24, 2009 - 07:18 pm:Jeez, it must be a pain, Rob, knowing all that and yet, knowing it is superior.
For sure, if that is what you classify as superior. |
Andrew Duaso
TryHard Victoria V8
Posts: 491 Reg: 02-2009
| wow i should have brought a TT but talking stock for stock a std family car V6 toyota aurion will smoke a stock tt and use less than 10L/100km |
Jose-Antonio Castillo
Goo Roo NSW Both Soarers
Posts: 1736 Reg: 07-2005
|
Rob Rojo wrote on Wednesday, December 23, 2009 - 10:26 pm:Jose, I think this one was yours, It was laggy because it had the DD steel wheel turbos (Ebay specials) which actually have less fins on the compressor side than the factory turbos.
Dammit don't show me that photo! I want it back Yeah, the turbos were swapped out for those (didn't know much better at the time) but went nicely once the revs were up. |
Ali Saeed
Goo Roo WA V8 Limited
Posts: 1548 Reg: 09-2007
| i think the only way you can call the v8 underpowered is when youve actually driven a TT soarer. if you went from a pulser or a civic to a v8 soarer there would be more than enough power. as for economy, ive got a fully loaded(heavy as fK apparently) v8 and it averages a nice 580kms per tank, and thats with a giving it a bit of squirt. ive managed 700kms on a tank, and thats only 70% freeway/highway driving. you mustve had bad luck with the v8s you had cause mine seems to be more intact that most TT's ive driven/seen. anyway, there are more aftermarket alternatives for a 1jz and 2jz than the 1uz, which is probably why the 1uz parts are more expensive. agreed about the struts. i still dont get how people arrive to that weight figure. if they have the same amount of kit they should weight exactly the same, or the v8 should weight less because its ment to be lighter. unfortunately they didnt fix the power issue till the vvti, which we didnt get. ive seen quite a few vvti 1uz in the us with intake and exhaust hit over 160rwkw. some even claim 170rwkw, up 20-30rwkw from a stock vvti 1uz. its not just the power but a better and more powerful torque curve. anyway not saying i wouldnt have a TT, im saying id have a v8 as a daily over a TT, because soarers ment to be a smooth, refined, fat GT car, which the v8 does best. |
Peter Nitschke
Junk Filterer South Australia UZZ30 UZZ31
Posts: 11177 Reg: 11-2004
| Replacing the turbos on a V8 is way cheaper than on the TT. |
Rob Rojo
Goo Roo NSW TT
Posts: 3065 Reg: 12-2007
|
Andrew Duaso wrote on Thursday, December 24, 2009 - 07:30 pm:wow i should have brought a TT but talking stock for stock a std family car V6 toyota aurion will smoke a stock tt and use less than 10L/100km
A stock Aurion runs 15.2-15.3 standard but If you get the TT off the line properly will run a high 14 stock but yeah the Aurion is very good on fuel and on a roll on would probably beat a stock Soarer TT. Peter Nitschke wrote on Thursday, December 24, 2009 - 08:41 pm:Replacing the turbos on a V8 is way cheaper than on the TT.
I thought the twin turbo kits on the V8's were around $5000, I paid $300 for set for the TT. |
Ali Saeed
Goo Roo WA V8 Limited
Posts: 1550 Reg: 09-2007
| Dan Panickar's stocko TT ran a 14.3 lol so im sure its much quicker than an aurion. |
Andrew Duaso
TryHard Victoria V8
Posts: 492 Reg: 02-2009
| mate an aurion does a mid 14's thats fact! i have done so in a Hertz rental and there is a vid on youtube of a totally stock zr6 doing a 14.5 and they are heavier, there is also a trd aurion pulling a 13.7, if you could launch them they would go much better.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6EliEwvR_4 still 100% stock for stock out old cant compare to a modern machine, ever read the test where the stock tarago v6 pulled a 14.95 @ calder? v6 model, the one with 200 killer wasps man i even know of a 100% stock magna (ralliart manual) that did a 14.1, thats a magna ffs... anyway whocares about straightlie, where other than drags do you run flatout till 180km/h |
Ali Saeed
Goo Roo WA V8 Limited
Posts: 1551 Reg: 09-2007
| my mums 2ton rav4(the 4 cylinder one) can manage a 9 sec 0-100. the v6 ones, with the same engine as an aurion, are much faster. |
|