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Scott Vim
TryHard
Vic
Soarer (1uz) Chaser (1jz)

Posts: 464
Reg: 12-2010

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Wednesday, December 12, 2012 - 02:17 pm, by:  Scott Vim (1uz1jz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey I think I'm going to put my Soarer on LPG. I've had one on gas before- went harder then on fuel. It was an Impco system. Very reliable traditional system. I got it done at Smithy's in Bayswater. I noticed a couple of threads a few guys were a bit unhappy with the work they did. For me my car had to go back 2 or 3 times to fix an issue it had where it would have barely rev past 4,000rpm. Once it got past 4,500rpm it went hard to redline. After they fixed that it was a great setup. Made running it on fuel seem boring and sluggish.
So my question is
1) Should I look elsewhere and does anyone know any good places that do custom LPG systems and know the Soarer.
2) Traditional system or injected? I thought the traditional system was good enough this is going back 5 years though.

Don't want comments like LPG is for bbq's etc. Got enough of that on these forums already.
James Buchan
Goo Roo
Vic
V8, vvti single turbo

Posts: 1572
Reg: 10-2008

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Wednesday, December 12, 2012 - 03:20 pm, by:  James Buchan (Jrbuch) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You should be able to get some good power with injection. My understanding (excuse me if I am wrong) is that the old carbie system is not as expensive, but not as good either.

Let me know how you go (We'll probably catch up well before you put it onto LPG anyway though mate)
Allan Langford
DieHard
Vic
UZZ31

Posts: 786
Reg: 05-2010

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Wednesday, December 12, 2012 - 03:52 pm, by:  Allan Langford (Allan) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Injection is the way to go, but like anything only if it is done right!

my biggest concern is most LPG installers tool box contains two hammers, a screwdriver and a shifter and thats it, the hack jobs I have seen on most cars makes me very nervous!

Good luck!
Scott Vim
TryHard
Vic
Soarer (1uz) Chaser (1jz)

Posts: 465
Reg: 12-2010

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Wednesday, December 12, 2012 - 04:37 pm, by:  Scott Vim (1uz1jz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Who is a good installer?
James Buchan
Goo Roo
Vic
V8, vvti single turbo

Posts: 1574
Reg: 10-2008

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Thursday, December 13, 2012 - 01:31 pm, by:  James Buchan (Jrbuch) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You may have to google it. But yeah the injection system is very good, but the prohibitive thing is the initial outlay for the lpg injectors. Read they're a tad pricey. Things may have changed since I did all my reading
Scott Vim
TryHard
Vic
Soarer (1uz) Chaser (1jz)

Posts: 467
Reg: 12-2010

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Thursday, December 13, 2012 - 01:34 pm, by:  Scott Vim (1uz1jz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Nah injected is expensive. Even vapour injection.
Scott Vim
TryHard
Vic
Soarer (1uz) Chaser (1jz)

Posts: 468
Reg: 12-2010

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Thursday, December 13, 2012 - 07:50 pm, by:  Scott Vim (1uz1jz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Spoke to a place in lilydale vapour is about $4k. Liquid is far too expensive around 6k. And apparently there is not enough room for a carby type impco system.
John Stafford
TryHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 432
Reg: 02-2010

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Friday, December 21, 2012 - 08:53 pm, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I had mine done in Melbourne over a year ago, with prins type injectors and BRM square vaporiser. Jack, of Alltech Dandenong, who has over 20 years experience and knows what to do with a Soarer V8 did a good job. The car goes well but the Bosch iridium Platinum plugs started missfiring after 20,000. I went back to copper core standards with a grove in them until I could get the silver plugs advertised in ebay, which are the only way to go with LPG. More power and more economy but you have to retune. I suggest getting the silver plugs first so it can be tuned properly from the start.

Alltech's system will cost you over $4000 but it well installed and can be tuned over the internet.


If you want the best out of the system then those installers with a dyno will get it at its best but you will pay for that, maybe up to $6000.

The old mixer system will not give you the horsepower or the response of the injection systems and the prins type injectors (not genuine Prins from Holland but the Korean copies, as the originals cost the earth) are much better than the solenoid type, They also last for at least 100,000 klm warantee period.

Any questions you can ring and talk to me in the new year if you are not in a hurry. I am in Thailand where there are plenty of 1UZs with the old mixer type system that fun fine. The later engines with VVTI have to have the injection system. I tried both on my 2JZ VVTI and there is no comparison.

One last thing:
The beauty of having LPG is that you can use your car the way it was meant to be used, lots of fun for the cost of running a hot 4 cylinder.

ph: 753094971
cheers John


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Scott Vim
TryHard
Vic
Soarer (1uz) Chaser (1jz)

Posts: 486
Reg: 12-2010

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Friday, December 21, 2012 - 10:15 pm, by:  Scott Vim (1uz1jz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Guy at work got his xr6 turbo on gas lpg vapour for about $3200. Does the silver plugs run well on petrol as well? $6 must be for liquid injection?
John Stafford
TryHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 433
Reg: 02-2010

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Saturday, December 22, 2012 - 02:29 am, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

XR6 is six cylinder, so 8 cylinders could cost $4200 using that same maths.
The silver plugs are supposedly standard on Petrol injected Lamborghini.
I was quoted $5000 for dyno tuned set up on my V8 that was top of the range vapour but that did not have prins type injectors, which are good for turbo set up. The real prins injectors, if I remember, cost over $2500 just for the injectors but are quoted to have life of over 240,000 klms! The engineer and the tuner must work hand in hand to get the very best set up. I didn't go that way but did get a very good job, maybe not as good as is possible but still worth it.

The vapour injection certainly has the figures to impress but the pumps, according to English insurance companies, are very expensive (over 1000 U.K. pounds) and haven't yet got a good track record for longivity. Maybe this has been fixed since my reading up on this a bit more than a year ago.

If you do 10,000 klms per year you save about $1300 a year so if the system costs you a grand more then that is only one year difference. You have to ask yourself if you are going to keep the car. Remember that the government is still giving $1000 incentive.

Cheers John
Scott Vim
TryHard
Vic
Soarer (1uz) Chaser (1jz)

Posts: 487
Reg: 12-2010

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Saturday, December 22, 2012 - 12:47 pm, by:  Scott Vim (1uz1jz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Based on my calculations of using premium at about $1.60 vs .70 cents I would save about $2500 a year. I think that's pretty disappointing that the injectors fail after 100,000kms. Yeah I'm keeping the car and its a daily and does at least 10,000kms a year.
John Stafford
TryHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 435
Reg: 02-2010

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Saturday, December 22, 2012 - 01:17 pm, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The suggested reliability time for solenoid injectors is less than half that, sometimes 20 - 40,000 and you can have problems. The Prins give minimum of 100,000 klms.
Allan Langford
DieHard
Vic
UZZ31

Posts: 796
Reg: 05-2010

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Saturday, December 22, 2012 - 02:30 pm, by:  Allan Langford (Allan) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

LPG use is not 1:1 it's more like 1.3:1 cruise and 2:1 power as the energy content in LPG is lower so you use more
John Stafford
TryHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 437
Reg: 02-2010

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Saturday, December 22, 2012 - 04:35 pm, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi Allan,
I use 15% more LPG than petrol 98% octane all round on the average. This should go back to equal amounts according to the Brisk claims. The set that is right for the V8 soarer is about $100 if I remember correctly..
We will see when I get them installed and retuned.
Cheers John
Allan Langford
DieHard
Vic
UZZ31

Posts: 797
Reg: 05-2010

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Saturday, December 22, 2012 - 05:53 pm, by:  Allan Langford (Allan) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

yeah John but you drive like a retired/missionary/preacher man ;) I think what your getting is spot on! trust me 2:1 LPG usage under "hard" driving is the norm... as is 1.3:1 or 15% more for cruise
Scott Vim
TryHard
Vic
Soarer (1uz) Chaser (1jz)

Posts: 488
Reg: 12-2010

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Saturday, December 22, 2012 - 06:24 pm, by:  Scott Vim (1uz1jz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

With a 1uz mixer got 16l/100km petrol vs 20l/100km gas. Injected has got to be better. Maybe it could use double if you were on the track.
Scott Vim
TryHard
Vic
Soarer (1uz) Chaser (1jz)

Posts: 489
Reg: 12-2010

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Saturday, December 22, 2012 - 07:14 pm, by:  Scott Vim (1uz1jz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My current soarer uses 11.5l100km. Predicting about 13l/100km with an injected system.
John Stafford
TryHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 438
Reg: 02-2010

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Saturday, December 22, 2012 - 07:52 pm, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Allan, You are probably right, I would drive more economically than some but that does not mean that I am an old fogy behind the wheel :-)
I was one of 6 that did what I think was one of the first "Peter Wherrett Advanced Driving" in Queensland at Lakeside in 1970 when I owned what was advertised as one of Queensland's fastest minis.
Unfortunately, the laws and penalties for speeding and aggressive driving today are extremely restrictive :-).

Remember driving to Melbourne from the Qld. NSW. boarder (Cunningham's gap) to Melbourne in daylight when it was legal to travel that fast. Alas, no more.

I got amazing economy in the mini too but the engine was a bit loose after the trip. Price of petrol then must have been about 14 cent per ltr when wages were about $60 a week, a tenth of today's basic wage, so the cost of fuel was comparable at $1.40 per ltr (ten times).

Interesting reminiscent when we are supposed to believe in evolution.

Cheers John
Scott Vim
DieHard
Vic
Soarer (1uz) Chaser (1jz)

Posts: 508
Reg: 12-2010

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Tuesday, January 15, 2013 - 01:10 pm, by:  Scott Vim (1uz1jz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey john what's the gas system those bloke use?
John Stafford
TryHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 463
Reg: 02-2010

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Tuesday, January 15, 2013 - 01:45 pm, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Scott, My consumption on the freeway is just what you said your is: 9klm/ltr (11.5 klm/100klms). and it is 7.5 lt/klm with LPG so exactly 15% more used.
The system is:
Stag 300 premium computer controller.
Prins type injectors from Korea (LPG/NGV type)
BRM vaporizer.
Ring and talk to Jack at Alltech Automotive and see what he offers if you are interested. My car goes well and costs half the price, when cruising, of what it would if I was running on 98 with a Coles' discount.

Cheers John
Scott Vim
DieHard
Vic
Soarer (1uz) Chaser (1jz)

Posts: 509
Reg: 12-2010

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Tuesday, January 15, 2013 - 02:01 pm, by:  Scott Vim (1uz1jz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It's hard to know what system is good. So many these days and every installer is using something different. Brm is impco which I have known to be good. There is omigas and emer as well.

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