Last x Days Posts  1 | 3 | 7 Days  Search  Topics  Tree View  Help
  Soarer Central * General Soarer Chat * What is faster a motor bike or a car?? * Archive through May 12, 2006 Previous Previous    Next Next  

Author Message
Stephen Waters
Tinkerer
Qld
TT

Posts: 15
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 05:08 pm, by:  Stephen Waters (Chevo) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Or Chuck Norris in the drivers seat
David Vaughan
Goo Roo
ACT
V8 manual

Posts: 1973
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 06:23 pm, by:  David Vaughan (Davidv) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

When a bike passes Chuck Norris, it has no rider.

He can roundhouse kick with the other foot on the accelerator.
Hesham Hammoudah
Tinkerer
Victoria
JZZ30 TT factory manual

Posts: 54
Reg: 04-2006

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 06:35 pm, by:  Hesham Hammoudah (Iverson) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

haha the amount of times me and my mates used to bag chuck norris back in year 12...
there would be a house with a door and a window next to each other and he would always take the window...and i remember one episode where him and this girl stole this plane and he starts it and takes off all fine and everything and flies it and she goes "i didn't know you could fly a plane" and he replies "i cant"
Don Bagnall
Moderator
New Zealand
I have LESS Soarers than Hayden :-(

Posts: 3500
Reg: 05-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 06:39 pm, by:  Don Bagnall (Baggs) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Chuck Norris sees you when you're sleeping and he knows when you're awake. He knows when you've been bad or good, so be good or be prepared to have your face demolished by a roundhouse kick.
Don Bagnall
Moderator
New Zealand
I have LESS Soarers than Hayden :-(

Posts: 3501
Reg: 05-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 06:41 pm, by:  Don Bagnall (Baggs) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Jesus turned water into wine. Chuck Norris turned wine into a bad temper and an aggravated assault.
Don Bagnall
Moderator
New Zealand
I have LESS Soarers than Hayden :-(

Posts: 3502
Reg: 05-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 06:42 pm, by:  Don Bagnall (Baggs) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Chuck Norris draws more blood than the Red Cross.
Don Bagnall
Moderator
New Zealand
I have LESS Soarers than Hayden :-(

Posts: 3503
Reg: 05-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 06:43 pm, by:  Don Bagnall (Baggs) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Legend has it that an epic battle took place between Chuck Norris' mullet and beard for the title of signature hair of Chuck Norris. Cast into obscurity, the defeated mullet was doomed to become Clay Aiken.
Jason Kingsmill
DieHard
NSW
UZZ31 Soarer V8

Posts: 609
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 07:34 pm, by:  Jason Kingsmill (Jason_k) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Don Bagnall wrote on Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 06:39 pm:

Chuck Norris sees you when you're sleeping and he knows when you're awake. He knows when you've been bad or good, so be good or be prepared to have your face demolished by a roundhouse kick.




Damian Ware
Tinkerer
Victoria
Camry

Posts: 89
Reg: 10-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 08:24 pm, by:  Damian Ware (Frozenpod) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Bike is much faster for standard production models.

My mates suzuki does just over 360km/hr and out handles any car I have driven.

As to slow corner try riding a smaller bike ie a CBR250 or even a suzuki 2 stroke then the bike will handle better again.

Its all about comparing apples to apples, bikes are faster but not as nice.

If it rains you get wet if some touches you will a car you fall off and maybe get driven over by a truck when it isn't you fault.

I come from the country and bikes are great for up the bush or riding in paddocks but for street use the are impractical and dangerous.
David Vaughan
Goo Roo
ACT
V8 manual

Posts: 1976
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 08:37 pm, by:  David Vaughan (Davidv) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I've been on the side of the bikes in this thread but when you say a bike "handles better" then what exactly do you mean? In general a car will generate higher cornering force than a bike -- it has more rubber on the road and keeps it flatter. Even in the Soarer I can thrash most bikes through corner apices and in the IS300 I have to be careful not to run them over. Besides, getting alongside would just lead to self-embarrassment when they twist the throttle on exit .

One can be fooled by the fact that a bike can take a straighter line through most corners and thus appears fast but a longer curve or a tight turn shows up the reality that they can not generate the same 'g' forces when laid over rather than in straight acceleration.
Peter Burrett
TryHard
ACT
2.5 VVTi ST

Posts: 332
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 09:16 pm, by:  Peter Burrett (Burrett) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What a silly thread.... tell me what speed the bike is doing, then tell me what speed the car is doing, and I'll try to work out which is the faster
Damian Ware
Tinkerer
Victoria
Camry

Posts: 90
Reg: 10-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 10:04 pm, by:  Damian Ware (Frozenpod) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well I drive cars on there limit all the time, my mate which has a CBR250 is about the same power wise maybe a little slower in a straight line.

But when we get out into the windy roads it is all over, it just really depends on the rider. When he goes around corners with his knee scraping on the ground it is at speeds where I cant keep up at all.

The only place a bike is slower is in a S bend where they have to completely changes their weight from one side to the other with no time to straighten up and accelerate in between.
Matthew Sharpe
DieHard
North Island
3.0 GT

Posts: 929
Reg: 10-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, May 12, 2006 - 06:30 am, by:  Matthew Sharpe (Madmatt) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

And thus another thread disintegrates into a discussion about Chuck Norris.
Luke Nieuwhof
DieHard
WA
Soarer TT

Posts: 894
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, May 12, 2006 - 07:34 am, by:  Luke Nieuwhof (Luke_nieuwhof) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

David, the bike will brake a lot better and come out of the corner a lot quicker than you ever will though.

With the right (read brave enough) rider, a bike will always be quicker. Power to weight is all its about at the end of the day and when some production bikes are pushing out the same rear wheel horsepower as the V8 Soarers here - game over.
Jason Kingsmill
DieHard
NSW
UZZ31 Soarer V8

Posts: 610
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, May 12, 2006 - 08:09 am, by:  Jason Kingsmill (Jason_k) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Luke, bikes can't brake as fast as a car! They will certainly get more exit speed though.
David Vaughan
Goo Roo
ACT
V8 manual

Posts: 1978
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, May 12, 2006 - 08:54 am, by:  David Vaughan (Davidv) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I know Luke . I think I have said those things repeatedly, from my first to my very last comment (see the line after which I used the embarrassed smiley).
Mike Triggs
DieHard
Norfolk Island
3.0GT G-Pack

Posts: 612
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, May 12, 2006 - 09:37 am, by:  Mike Triggs (Mikeandimah) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Damian Ware wrote on Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 08:24 pm:

I come from the country and bikes are great for up the bush or riding in paddocks but for street use the are impractical and dangerous.




Only idiot semi-blind car drivers make bikes dangerous (plus a few silly riders who don't take conditions into account). I rode continuously for 20 years, had a bike licence for 7 years before I bothered to get a car one.

Part of the issue with normal road conditions, at least in Australia, which limits how quickly a bike can get around compared to cars, is road uncertainty. You can push really hard through a bend on a bike only to find a gravel patch or worse, some diesel fuel. So the margin for error is slimmer. As David said, a car has more rubber on the road and while I believe a bike will thrash most cars through the twisties, the bike rider always has to be alert for hazards which wouldn't worry a car as much- besides gravel and oil there are small (even dead) animals, birds, branches, potholes, water patches in the shade, all sorts of things can be scarey when you're riding 10/10ths.
Luke Nieuwhof
DieHard
WA
Soarer TT

Posts: 898
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, May 12, 2006 - 11:07 am, by:  Luke Nieuwhof (Luke_nieuwhof) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

David, I see now. :-)

Jason, what types of bike have you been riding? I'm sorry but there is no way a car (even a light one) will pull up in the same time as a bike. I'm gonig on theory here so if you have figures or something I'll be happily proved wrong but 200kg vs 1.5 tonne for most cars - game over yet again.
Daniel Clarke
TryHard
NSW
TT 2.5L 6 cylinder

Posts: 180
Reg: 03-2006

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, May 12, 2006 - 11:58 am, by:  Daniel Clarke (Dieseltrain) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

But also, 4 Tyres, 4 Brakes, ABS on Cars, WOuldnt that be an advantage?
Mike Triggs
DieHard
Norfolk Island
3.0GT G-Pack

Posts: 613
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, May 12, 2006 - 12:19 pm, by:  Mike Triggs (Mikeandimah) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Given decent surface a bike will outbrake a car easily. In fact most bikes are overbraked, with two whopping discs up the front and another at the back. The limiting factor is often tyre adhesion, not braking power! On top of this most bikes have good engine braking (this was not the case in the "really old days" when some superbikes were two-strokes:-)).
Jason Kingsmill
DieHard
NSW
UZZ31 Soarer V8

Posts: 611
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, May 12, 2006 - 12:35 pm, by:  Jason Kingsmill (Jason_k) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mate, do you know how large the tyre contact patch is for a bikes front tyre?

You're lucky if you can get a 25mm cross section.

Think about a car...you can get pretty much the whole width of the tyre. lets say 235mm X 2, that's 470mm total.

My old bike(CBR600), 170kg's dry. Plus 75kg worth of me, plus about 25kg worth of fluids. That's 270Kg's.
A Soarer TT...1500kg's plus ~100kg's of fluids and 75kg driver, that's 1675kg's.

275kg divided by 25mm = 11 units of load
1675kg divided by 470mm = 3.56 units of load

Let's go further and say that half the front tyre is making contact with the ground(average 110mm wide front tyre). That's 55mm. Do the sum, that's 5 units of load.

It's is much more complex than that, but that is putting it simply. There is also the fact that the amount of load on the front tyre isn't even at the entire contact area, as it is a "round" surface, unlike a relatively flat car tyre, disregarding some small camber effects.

Then take into account that the rear tyre on a bike is only about 5% of effective braking under maximum force, where it is much more in a car.

The only thing that bikes have in advantage is(in general terms) more braking power per weight unit. If you are in a car with a satisfactorily sized braking system(ie, can lock the wheels/activate ABS at high speed), then you will have it all over a bike.
Jason Kingsmill
DieHard
NSW
UZZ31 Soarer V8

Posts: 612
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, May 12, 2006 - 12:43 pm, by:  Jason Kingsmill (Jason_k) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Engine braking on bikes is only really used while not under race(speeding) conditions. As I mentioned above, rear braking power is only about 5% of maximum braking potential. The rear brakes on any decent bike is quite capable of fulfilling their duties without the need for engine braking.
(We're talking road bikes and road going cars, not superbikes modified for the track)
David Vaughan
Goo Roo
ACT
V8 manual

Posts: 1980
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, May 12, 2006 - 01:04 pm, by:  David Vaughan (Davidv) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

In a hard stop, engine braking does absolutely nothing that the brakes will not, adding a gigantic zero to the rear braking force available at the road when you stomp your foot on the panic pedal. This was true even of a 1950s FJ Holden with drum brakes let alone a Soarer or modern bike with discs and ABS. Back in the '50s though, engine braking (rather than foot braking) was popular because it delayed brake fade on hills and helped you crash more slowly when your brakes failed. It is also a convenient way of controlling speed on downhill stretches, or when you expect to need to change down anyway.

I do not use engine braking much, except occasionally downhill, ever since brake fade ceased to be a substantial issue. If I need to change down sharply on a hill, I do it under braking to avoid a snatched takeup destabilising the rear end.
Mike Triggs
DieHard
Norfolk Island
3.0GT G-Pack

Posts: 614
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, May 12, 2006 - 02:25 pm, by:  Mike Triggs (Mikeandimah) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

We'll have to let the braking thing go through to the keeper- I have ridden extensively (20 bikes spread over 20 years) and firmly believe most motorcyles with good brakes will outbrake most cars (note- I am not talking about ABS here) given reasonable adhesion (in other words, not in the wet).

As for engine braking, it wasn't mentioned as a huge contributing factor. However, it's very useful on a big twin or single bike from 30-40 years ago, with a single leading shoe front brake. Believe me, engine braking with those old Pommy engines was massive.
Cihan Aday
DieHard
Victoria
JZZ30

Posts: 787
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, May 12, 2006 - 03:08 pm, by:  Cihan Aday (Cihan) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Damian Ware wrote on Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 08:24 pm:

Bike is much faster for standard production models.

My mates suzuki does just over 360km/hr and out handles any car I have driven.



And which suziki motorbike is that?

What has suzuki released in my 5 minute absense from the motorcycle world?

Even the ducati desmosedici doesnt do 360...

  Administration Administration      Log Out Log Out Previous Previous      Next Next