Soarer Central: Anyone any ideas? Fraudulent seller....

Soarer Central Off-Topic Anyone any ideas? Fraudulent seller....

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John Jantzen
TryHard
Tasmania
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Friday, January 20, 2012 - 10:33 am, by: John Jantzen (Taslex)

In another thread a member suggested that having so many good trading experiences with the Soarer Community tends to give one a false sense of security. I can only agree with what he says! Generally my trust in other Soarer owners (and indeed EBay sellers) has not been misplaced, and I realize now I've acquired a false sense of security through this.

Now I'm really paying badly!!

In late November I bought some parts on EBay from a seller who is also a member here. I negotiated with him that although his ebay item description said collect only, he would in fact post the items - which it would have to be as we live 1000's of Kms apart. Anyway, went ahead with the bid, secured the items and paid for them ($201), tried to get a courier but found that any courier who would do the job at all expected the items to be boxed and the seller reckoned he couldn't find suitable boxes, but he could bag the items - which I had checked as OK for Aus Post.
The seller claimed to be too busy with his work to get a quotation, so, as I already had some similar items, I bagged them, weighed them, got a postage quote and sent the money for the postage ($102.10) to the seller. Everything went dead quiet then for over a fortnight. Emails were not responded to, no goods arrived, nothing.

I opened an item-not-received dispute case with EBay, but apart from getting the offer of a refund out of the seller no good came of it.
Since Christmas I've been getting nothing but empty promises about a refund, even though I've suggested he keep $23.10 of it to offset any loss he has sustained. Throughout I have been patient and polite and I have done as much leg-work as I can to achieve a good outcome.

I think it's likely I've "done my dough" and I'm really angry with myself for even going ahead with the purchase. I wonder where I should go next?

EBay suggested the police. I'm reluctant to do this as I probably will never see my parts or money after that happens.

To protect other SC members and Soarer owners, I want to publish the seller's name/ID but it will also cost me any chance of ever seeing my goods or money.

What should I do? $303.10 out of pocket and not happy!

I hope if you read this and are thinking about a deal through a seller here, it doesn't put you off. I'm happy to receive a PM and tell you if the person you are about to buy from is or isn't my problem seller - but for the reasons above I will not publish his name or ID here or anywhere else. I will say he is not one of the regular sellers who have sold stacks of stuff on this site.

Drew Rechner
DieHard
South Australia
:-(

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Friday, January 20, 2012 - 02:42 pm, by: Drew Rechner (Drew1jz)

I think we know who the seller is here mate and he has been banned permanently.

Is it Josh Baldwin or Baldwin imports..?

James Wilson
DieHard
sa
TT

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Friday, January 20, 2012 - 03:17 pm, by: James Wilson (Ser493)

There are a few bad seeds out there at the moment, what these dodgy dealers need to know is one day they will do this to the wrong person and it will be game over.

Perhaps get someone local to him to put some pressure on, if you have any details for him and are lucky enough to have some one who can do that.

John Jantzen
TryHard
Tasmania
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Friday, January 20, 2012 - 03:43 pm, by: John Jantzen (Taslex)

Drew Rechner wrote on Friday, January 20, 2012 - 02:42 pm:
Is it Josh Baldwin or Baldwin imports..?

Turning this into a guessing game is not helpful and will get us no-where. I said I will not reveal his identity - who knows, he MIGHT even turn around and do the right thing by his customers - and I will stick to that.
Look, just to head off much of the further guessing and help those buying in the other states, I will say he's in Qld.

And no, it is NOT Josh or his company.

John Jantzen
TryHard
Tasmania
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Friday, January 20, 2012 - 04:00 pm, by: John Jantzen (Taslex)

James Wilson wrote on Friday, January 20, 2012 - 03:17 pm:
There are a few bad seeds out there at the moment, what these dodgy dealers need to know is one day they will do this to the wrong person and it will be game over.

Perhaps get someone local to him to put some pressure on, if you have any details for him and are lucky enough to have some one who can do that.

Thanks for the comment. I don't have anyone near him who is "persuasive" enough to get a result, even if I wanted to go this way - which I don't.

All I can do is to point out to him that the Soarer Community is well connected and once his name and reputation get around he won't find anyone prepared to take the risk of buying from him. (and he's got plenty of stuff he wants to sell!)

My tolerance of this situation does have its limits and if the few more avenues I may be able to use still fail to get back my money or get the parts, then I will publish all his details here and on every other Soarer Forum I belong to too, as well as leaving negative feedback on EBay.

James Wilson
DieHard
sa
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Friday, January 20, 2012 - 04:03 pm, by: James Wilson (Ser493)

Post all this info up in the QLD section under events/cruises. That might create a bit more pressure from other local members who might tell him he needs to do the right thing.

Hakan Pasha
TryHard
Victoria
JZZ30

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Friday, January 20, 2012 - 04:20 pm, by: Hakan Pasha (Hakanpasha)

John Jantzen wrote on Friday, January 20, 2012 - 04:00 pm:
All I can do is to point out to him that the Soarer Community is well connected and once his name and reputation get around he won't find anyone prepared to take the risk of buying from him. (and he's got plenty of stuff he wants to sell!)

That won't happen until you reveal his identity to the Soarer community and someone else may get burned in the meantime.

John Jantzen
TryHard
Tasmania
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Friday, January 20, 2012 - 04:32 pm, by: John Jantzen (Taslex)

Hakan Pasha wrote on Friday, January 20, 2012 - 04:20 pm:
John Jantzen wrote on Friday, January 20, 2012 - 04:00 pm:

All I can do is to point out to him that the Soarer Community is well connected and once his name and reputation get around he won't find anyone prepared to take the risk of buying from him. (and he's got plenty of stuff he wants to sell!)

That won't happen until you reveal his identity to the Soarer community and someone else may get burned in the meantime.

Yes, I realize that, which is why I say I WILL respond to a PM if someone is worried about a deal they are doing or about to do with a Queensland seller.

The attitude of my seller is such that he'll probably say I'm slandering him if I name him in the open community, and he'll certainly just 'jack up' and refuse to meet his obligations.

James Wilson
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Friday, January 20, 2012 - 04:36 pm, by: James Wilson (Ser493)

John Jantzen wrote on Friday, January 20, 2012 - 04:32 pm:
and he'll certainly just 'jack up' and refuse to meet his obligations.

Very true, play it out to the end then burn him.

Dan McColl
Goo Roo
Victoria (The Nazi State)
Pretty Red Thing and The Black Rattler

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Friday, January 20, 2012 - 05:24 pm, by: Dan McColl (Hoon)

John, PM me or give me a call. 0408 159 339.

I'm in QLD, and depending where the seller is I may be able to collect the parts and ship them to you.

Joshua Rao
Goo Roo
WA
TT (for sale $5.2k), 97 Blk UZZ31, 97 JZZ30 vvti turbo white manual, 96 vvti turbo manual, Legnum VR4, MR2 sw20, Alfa 156

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Saturday, January 21, 2012 - 01:57 am, by: Joshua Rao (Soaren1)

Name and shame

Daniel Clarke
Goo Roo
NSW
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Saturday, January 21, 2012 - 07:52 am, by: Daniel Clarke (Dieseltrain)

SOrry but if its been this long , and you are wanting to " Flush " him/her out , then you need to throw a name up so people can help out , or At least stop others from suffering the same conequences .

Dan McColl
Goo Roo
Victoria (The Nazi State)
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Saturday, January 21, 2012 - 10:16 am, by: Dan McColl (Hoon)

The problem is that as soon as you name and shame you have no chance of getting your goods.

Need to make sure you've exhausted all other options first.

John Jantzen
TryHard
Tasmania
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Saturday, January 21, 2012 - 02:09 pm, by: John Jantzen (Taslex)

Thanks Dan. Joshua and Daniel I respect your opinion and understand your frustration, but if you earnt what I earn per week you'd understand why I can't just sacrifice $300 for the Soarer Community, no matter how much I respect them.

I'll PM anyone who's concerned as promised, and if the matter is not settled satisfactorily, I will eventually name and shame. If the seller should happen to the right thing, I will certainly report that too.

Oh, by the way, to add to my seller's "dodginess", I have had a careful look at who's been bidding on his EBay lots, and it looks suspiciously like he "shill bid" me up $50 on the parts too, as I can't see why the same bidder (with only 8 FB points) would bid on a set of these parts for a Skyline and a similar product for a Soarer in the one day, advance the price of each by $50, then just pull out. What they are is highly specific to one make of car, incidentally.

David Grima
Goo Roo
WA
1JZ-GTE TT

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Saturday, January 21, 2012 - 04:49 pm, by: David Grima (Maltezr)

hmmm dodgy indeed

Daniel Clarke
Goo Roo
NSW
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Saturday, January 21, 2012 - 07:30 pm, by: Daniel Clarke (Dieseltrain)

NO worries man , regardless of income , $30 is hard to come by nowadays let alone $300 ! I got 2 kids and a mortgage , i feel the pain

Hopefully it all works out for you

Steve Bridges
Newbie
nsw
UZZ31 V8 Limited

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Sunday, January 22, 2012 - 12:04 pm, by: Steve Bridges (Hashi_hayato)

Hope this 'frustrating' issue gets resolved soon John. By the way, Dan McColl is a great contact to have up there in Qld. All the best, Steve.

Lew Radbourn
Goo Roo
Queensland / Goodna
uzz30 93'super charged . 502Hp Toyota lite ace

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Sunday, January 22, 2012 - 05:24 pm, by: Lew Radbourn (Marlew)

John;
Send Dan the details mate and allow him to help you out if he can at least that way dan will be able to pick the parts up and get them sent down to you.
If this guy is in Brisbane it is easy for Dan or on week ends.I can go around as well and pick the parts up.

Ross Spataro
DieHard
victoria
uzz31

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Sunday, January 22, 2012 - 07:49 pm, by: Ross Spataro (Thfc)

name and shame the prick....IMHO....if you think that exposing his identity on here will do less harm than sending someone around to trespass on his property, then i believe you are totally wrong....if i ripped someone off from here, and they, or anyone else trespassed on my property, they would be in for a rude shock....just name the arsehole, and at least protect anyone else who may not see this thread and send money to him for other goods.....btw...its just my own opinion....sorry about your money loss....

Aiden Cheese
Goo Roo
QLD
Soarer jzz30

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Monday, January 23, 2012 - 05:18 pm, by: Aiden Cheese (Chillpen)

I don't think you've quite understood Ross, this isn't about going over and convincing with a physical confrontation. It's about telling the seller that he doesn't need time anymore.

The seller just has to be home so Dan can pick up the parts as per the original Ebay listing. Dan will do it on John's part.

The pressure of someone calling foul his scam should be enough to have him just give up the parts. If he refuses to give up the parts then it's a pretty clearcut.

Although frankly you should seek the legal system too sooner rather than later and make sure your emails are well documented both outgoing and incoming.

It's not that hard to draft up and send a letter of demand, implying that you'll press charges if he doesn't send them promptly.

PS: Scams only work if you let them.

John Jantzen
TryHard
Tasmania
V8 '31

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Tuesday, January 24, 2012 - 11:51 am, by: John Jantzen (Taslex)

Thanks for the comments.

I've just been doing some Googling of my seller and I've found him on many forums for Skyline, Lexus, Evo, Datsun, RX-7 etc and other sites, where he's projecting an image as an OK sort of a person. Some of these other forums he has been on as recently as 19th-20th January....

I suspect too that the suburb may be either Coorparoo, or Greenslopes which adjoin each other. Said he was near Coorparoo Paint & Panels in one post. I wonder if this post is still current? Mentioned Greenslopes when I talked about a quote to post from the closest post office.

Have noticed more posts referring to being "ill" or even "terminally ill".

I had been cutting him some slack because of this, but even if he was, you'd think he'd want to get his affairs in order so his family weren't bothered by legal problems later on.

Update: Well, I now have information which should speed the process up a bit. Next step will be to tell him to make a day and time to be available to pay a cash refund or hand over the goods!

John Jantzen
TryHard
Tasmania
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Friday, January 27, 2012 - 04:21 pm, by: John Jantzen (Taslex)

Update:
Yesterday I Pm'ed him here, on EBay and on SkylinesAU indicating that I had his address details and requesting he be available for someone to collect items. No response whatsoever!

So - today is a bit of a crunch day.

I'll start out by saying a very big "thank you" to all of those members who offered me help and useful suggestions.
Today was close as dammit to the 60 day feedback limit on EBay, and I did not want to let the opportunity to leave feedback go past. The seller won't like what I've written but it's honest anyway.

Now I have basically written off the idea of getting a voluntary refund or ever seeing the parts. I have set in motion a legal process, which may cost me a bit of money, but should give me the satisfaction that this cheat will not profit from me, anyway!

I'll remember to post again in a while to let you know the outcome of my action. Should it have been as successful as I believe it will be, I will then detail what I did.

By the way, my seller trades as l28fan (that's little "L"), if you want to see just how bad a record you can have and still be allowed to trade. EBay's grievance procedure was worse than useless and I don't think I'll buy anything there again till they clean up their act!

David Goldthorpe
TryHard
NSW
UZZ31 GT-L

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Friday, January 27, 2012 - 07:00 pm, by: David Goldthorpe (Sprocket82)

John, did you pay for the item via Paypal? I think they have a policy of helping unhappy customers don't they? Of course, it may be too late for that by now...

John Jantzen
TryHard
Tasmania
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Friday, January 27, 2012 - 07:22 pm, by: John Jantzen (Taslex)

Good point, David. Unfortunately (?) I didn't. He specified "no Paypal" (which EBay hates people doing!) and so I used bank to bank transfer. Haven't heard many good things of PayPal, and they charge an awful amount to the seller - which is a good reason anyone would say "no PayPal" except EBay forces you to use it as it's their company.

We'll see how it all goes....

Ali Saeed
Goo Roo
WA
1994 Honda Accord M/T

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Saturday, January 28, 2012 - 02:17 am, by: Ali Saeed (Ali)

call your bank and tell them what happened, they usually refund it if you attach a police report or something

Darren Bauer
TryHard
Victoria
Soarer TT

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Sunday, January 29, 2012 - 10:01 pm, by: Darren Bauer (Dazmon)

I won a Soarer part on eBay last week and the seller informed me of the 'real' price a few days later, hope no-one else from here bought the other parts he was selling, they all went pretty cheap. Seller was from Victoria. He's done this before to other buyers who have won items for too cheap.

David Grima
Goo Roo
WA
1JZ-GTE TT

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Sunday, January 29, 2012 - 11:18 pm, by: David Grima (Maltezr)

John Jantzen wrote on Friday, January 27, 2012 - 04:21 pm:
Now I have basically written off the idea of getting a voluntary refund or ever seeing the parts

Darren Bauer wrote on Sunday, January 29, 2012 - 10:01 pm:
I won a Soarer part on eBay last week and the seller informed me of the 'real' price a few days later, hope no-one else from here bought the other parts he was selling, they all went pretty cheap. Seller was from Victoria. He's done this before to other buyers who have won items for too cheap.

you guys should name and shame these sellers so no one else here gets stung by dodgy deals

Darren Bauer
TryHard
Victoria
Soarer TT

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Sunday, January 29, 2012 - 11:32 pm, by: Darren Bauer (Dazmon)

talatk

eBay told me to leave him bad feedback - W O W !
And he is still selling so they don't care...

John Jantzen
TryHard
Tasmania
V8 '31

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Monday, January 30, 2012 - 09:15 am, by: John Jantzen (Taslex)

Darren Bauer wrote on Sunday, January 29, 2012 - 11:32 pm:
eBay told me to leave him bad feedback - W O W !
And he is still selling so they don't care...

It amazes me that EBay are doing nothing in your case, as they are being robbed of fees by this seller and you would have thought the mighty $ would have spoken to them!

EBay was useless in my case too. My seller is still trading - with an 81.4% feedback score!
They are so bound up in what they tout as "privacy" but which seems to me more like protecting bad sellers. They say that actions taken against the seller will not be revealed to the complainant - so they can get away with doing stuff-all? They hide potential shill bidders behind random IDs. They limit the time you can leave feedback so you are eventually forced to do it, even though the case may not be solved. Forced? OK, maybe that's a bit strong, but you really wouldn't want a bad seller to get away without other buyers being warned, would you?
They make items invisible after a few months - which in my case meant I couldn't check whether the item I was buying had been "sold" previously to someone else who also left negative feedback about having paid for it ($200+) and never seeing it.

By the way, if you ever open an "item not received" case in EBay think again before closing it. Despite them claiming that this will "escalate" the dispute all they do is give you a link to report the buyer to the police, tell you to leave negative feedback, and that's that. You'd think they would have stronger action available to them "in house" rather than the complication of police action.