Last x Days Posts  1 | 3 | 7 Days  Search  Topics  Tree View  Help
  Soarer Central * Suspension * New Adjustable Rear Toe arms & traction Rods, Very strong rose joint type Previous Previous    Next Next  

Author Message
Dave Cazes
TryHard
sa
tt

Posts: 314
Reg: 08-2007

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, January 30, 2009 - 03:21 pm, by:  Dave Cazes (Cazman) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here are some new arms I've had made for myself, if you cant be bothered reading they are REAR toe and traction arms, and the PICS ARE DOWN THE BOTTOM

I've been working on these for about 2 months now and finally they are coming together. With in the month they will be ready.

These are Rear adjustable toe arms to replace the factory ones, and also new rear traction arms.

The factory toe adjustment is a cam lobe adj, where you turn the inside bolt around and it then effectively makes the arm shorter or longer.
Alot of people have found that they have run out of adjustment in the factory gear and cant align their cars to factory or desired alignment specs.

These new ones aren't a new design, but area better than factory design. They are also about 10 times stronger.
This arm is "turnbuckle" style, and has 1 left hand and one right hand thread, so when you rotate the center bar the arm gets longer or shorter.
This allows for extremely quick alignments and also if youve ever watched someone align your car you will see that, you adjust one thing like camber, and then your toe goes out, so they have to start again, this fixed this problem.

The other major benefit is that it has a "rose joint" (heim joint, spherical joint etc)
The major benefit of this is less flex than a conventional bush. Much less, actually 0 flex at all. This allows your alignment to stay accurate during cornering.
The down side of rose joints is that they increase noise vibration, except in this case it is so minor you wont even notice it. The Toe arms in ALL factory cars are technically rose jointed at the front, and in most good cars that have rear toe adjustment (GTRs etc) have the same setup too from the factory.
I can guarantee that doing the toe arms in a rose joint will not increase NVB enough for you to notice.
But if you were to do the camber arms, lower arms etc, you would def notice it.

The other arm is the traction arm, this helps prevent wheel hop/ axle tramp. It can also be adjusted to alter your rear wheel alignment, but i would not suggest doing so unless you are looking at racing the car, as this will effect the dynamic camber (the good one)
I would use these simply for the added stiffness as with the toe arms. Now these ones will add some NVB but its not as bad as you would think, but it will be minor.
For me, the trade off is well worth it.

Other examples on the market:
There are 3 major brands available, all varying in cost, but not in much in design.

These are the cheapest and worst, with reported failures, Chinese made and not recommended, they also only do the traction arm, not the rear toe arm.
At $199 a pair its not that bad really, but I would risk it myself.
http://www.justjap.com/store/product.php?productid=18045&cat=0&page=1

Battle version are the next, and very decent too, with a very good rep in the USA but there are no distributors in Aus, and by the time they arrived and had markup put on them they would be very dear.
They are $275 USD per pair

http://www.battleversion.com/
Click MK IV as they are the same

The next being the best in the business, but way over priced, some of their parts I can understand but these are really dear. Really
These are $979 a pair USD + shipping etc
http://www.rhdjapan.com/jdm-low/Ikeya-Formula-Rear-Toe-Adjuster-Rod-for-Toyota-51463


The ones i had had made for myself are the best quality materials I could buy, and everything has had to be made for me with the exception of the rose joints.

The rose joints are 5/8 chromeolly ends, the same as McDonald racing bros and come with a hefty $55ea price tag. These will also have dust boots when im finished

The Turnbuckle adjusters are Steel with a 22mm outer and are solid, you will never bend these ever. They are plated to prevent rust, but can be powder coated too.
I have access to aluminum ones too, and they are slightly dearer and slightly lighter, but they are weaker, and steel bends while alum snaps.
I would rather limp home with a bent arm than have an arm snap and the rest break off ith them

The spacers in the ends convert the rose joint to be used in our cars, they are 304 stainless steel lathed up to my specs. these cost me an arm and a leg to have made, and I only had a small production run to accommodate 2 sets of arms (the min I could order, 2 cars worth)
THESE ARENT PRESSED IN IN THE PHOTO OF MINE, they are just sitting in there for the shot.

The other ends that bolt to the hub are still being made, the traction rod will be steel and powder coated silver, and the toe arm will utilse a new OEM style toe rod for reliability.

All im doing is letting you know, they will be ready in a month, and I have no intention of mass producing them. I can do small runs of 4 arms (2 cars worth) as thats the minimum, and they can be customised to be bigger, smaller, diff coloured, diff materail etc, as everything is "TO ORDER"

But the cost would be about $250 per pair at a guess, thats my cost as a favour to SC, but the toe arm would be the one most would want, and the traction arm I can only think of 3 other "race" soarers on here, not inc brendons.

Stay tuned



Dave Cazes
TryHard
sa
tt

Posts: 315
Reg: 08-2007

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, January 30, 2009 - 03:23 pm, by:  Dave Cazes (Cazman) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I forgot to mention,
The rose joints are made in the USA
The Jam nuts are made in the USA
The turnbuckles are made in NSW to my lengths
The Misalignment spacers and made in SA in 304 Stainless
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NSW
Soarer TT manual

Posts: 1217
Reg: 04-2006

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, January 30, 2009 - 07:11 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dave, I reckon I'd be interested in the rear toe arms. I'd need to get a lecture or a good book to understand the effect of tuning traction rods etc, but I can definitely see the advantage of the toe arms right now.
Dave Cazes
TryHard
sa
tt

Posts: 326
Reg: 08-2007

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Wednesday, February 04, 2009 - 01:27 pm, by:  Dave Cazes (Cazman) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My toe arms are done, traction rods will be another month away as I need some studs and some gear to be powder coated too.

I took my set home so no new pics yet, but Ill get some at some point
Jose-Antonio Castillo
Goo Roo
NSW
Soarer VVTi

Posts: 1625
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Saturday, February 07, 2009 - 09:54 am, by:  Jose-Antonio Castillo (Ahh_soarer) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Nice work mate, once you get them going let us know, I'd like to have a set for the car.
Justin Camilleri
DieHard
QLD
Had a 85 MZ10, 92 TT, Now 91 TT

Posts: 934
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Monday, February 09, 2009 - 06:33 pm, by:  Justin Camilleri (Just) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I like what you have done... and would also get a set.
Neil Mystery
Tinkerer
Ontario
Soarer TT

Posts: 50
Reg: 06-2008

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Tuesday, February 10, 2009 - 04:28 am, by:  Neil Mystery (92blacktt) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

if these could be mass produced and lowered the cost..you would have quite a large market. Supra/SC/Soarer etc would grab these up.
Dave Cazes
TryHard
sa
tt

Posts: 330
Reg: 08-2007

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Tuesday, February 10, 2009 - 09:11 pm, by:  Dave Cazes (Cazman) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

a lower cost would be the JJR items.

If they were mass produced it would get slightly cheaper as I wouldnt have to pay as much freight all up. So maybe $50 a pair less all up.
but it would need to be a bigger order
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NSW
Soarer TT manual

Posts: 1272
Reg: 04-2006

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Tuesday, February 10, 2009 - 10:03 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How big an order? Is it worth trying a group buy? There were a few guys at the OP track day who looked to be getting pretty serious...
Justin Camilleri
DieHard
QLD
Had a 85 MZ10, 92 TT, Now 91 TT

Posts: 935
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Tuesday, February 10, 2009 - 10:29 pm, by:  Justin Camilleri (Just) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

EOI to get it going perhaps..
Dave Cazes
TryHard
sa
tt

Posts: 331
Reg: 08-2007

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Wednesday, February 11, 2009 - 04:51 pm, by:  Dave Cazes (Cazman) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The last group buy i tried failed, I dont think anyone was keen :-)

Maybe 5 cars, that would prob just, just scrape in for costs, as i would want to run dust boots on these for reliability(less wear).
Brett Moloney
DieHard
Queensland
Supercharged UZZ31

Posts: 783
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Wednesday, February 11, 2009 - 06:47 pm, by:  Brett Moloney (Lxsv8) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm in
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NSW
Soarer TT manual

Posts: 1274
Reg: 04-2006

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Wednesday, February 11, 2009 - 07:24 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'd put other purchases on hold to be in on this and get it going.

The last group buy was plagued with "you can get it here for.." I don't think you would have that problem here, and the ricers need not apply.

As you said there may be only a few who'd get serious. I'm one of 'em and there seems to be a few others above.
Dave Cazes
TryHard
sa
tt

Posts: 332
Reg: 08-2007

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Thursday, February 12, 2009 - 10:12 am, by:  Dave Cazes (Cazman) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'll send a few emails off today and see what an order of 5 sets does to the price, I dont think it will get much cheaper, but I will save in freight.

5 sets would be the min, and also the traction rod is cheaper too :-)
Don Bagnall
Moderator
New Zealand
Mercedes Benz SLK230 Kompressor

Posts: 7269
Reg: 05-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Thursday, February 12, 2009 - 08:41 pm, by:  Don Bagnall (Baggs) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Ben Lipman wrote on Wednesday, February 11, 2009 - 07:24 pm:

The last group buy was plagued with "you can get it here for.."



You have my word (as a Moderator), that if ANY of that s h i t happens, I will DELETE the posts.

So there............Me!
Brett Moloney
DieHard
Queensland
Supercharged UZZ31

Posts: 786
Reg: 07-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Tuesday, February 17, 2009 - 01:01 pm, by:  Brett Moloney (Lxsv8) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I am interested in these however will be away for a couple of weeks. Please put my name on any list that may be started. Thanks
Dave Cazes
TryHard
sa
tt

Posts: 338
Reg: 08-2007

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Tuesday, February 17, 2009 - 04:43 pm, by:  Dave Cazes (Cazman) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I will keep you updated, The rear toe arms are a prick, as there are so many bits to be lathed up, its also not that cheap. I have got some quotes back already, but it also depends on what finish people want, whether it be zinced or powdercoated etc
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NSW
Soarer TT manual

Posts: 1296
Reg: 04-2006

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Tuesday, February 17, 2009 - 07:39 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cheapest? Whatever is cheap and hard wearing/long lasting. I couldn't care what they look like.




Well, maybe just a little. Oohs and aahs so you know where the money went are always a little satisfying.
Dave Cazes
TryHard
sa
tt

Posts: 340
Reg: 08-2007

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Wednesday, February 18, 2009 - 12:08 pm, by:  Dave Cazes (Cazman) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Zinc is the cheapest and longest lasting, it just looks like a dull chrome like in the pic.

Powdercoat is available for about $5, not as hard wearing but you can pick your colour.
Dave Cazes
TryHard
sa
tt

Posts: 401
Reg: 08-2007

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, April 17, 2009 - 03:40 pm, by:  Dave Cazes (Cazman) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Rear toe arm is on hold, as I cant have them made for a good price and still be reliable. $300 a pair of more.
The traction rods are good to go, just need some people to group buy them, as individually freighting the goods becomes dear (they slug me $25 per freight from 3 diff suppliers)
Gianni Matrogiannis
TryHard
nsw
SC400 V8

Posts: 254
Reg: 08-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, April 17, 2009 - 04:26 pm, by:  Gianni Matrogiannis (Gianni) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

how much would the traction rods be. Im not too sure what they are, but i have a big traction problem. My car is only street driven would they help. Are they used for better cornering or do they improve straight line traction too
Daniel Clarke
Goo Roo
NSW
TT 2.5L 6 cylinder

Posts: 4884
Reg: 03-2006

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Friday, April 17, 2009 - 04:59 pm, by:  Daniel Clarke (Dieseltrain) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey Gianni , Get some MT ET Streets !!! Haha
Dave Cazes
TryHard
sa
tt

Posts: 404
Reg: 08-2007

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Monday, April 20, 2009 - 10:44 am, by:  Dave Cazes (Cazman) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

im trying to get the price down to $250 or maybe even less. Maybe $200 + freight.

They increase tracion under poer if adjusted accordingly.
They will help the car "squat" down. In all instance where your flooring it it will give you more traction, but you technically lose power through the suspension arms. In this case its negligable but in drag cars they cant set the car up for say 90% squat or they would just lose 90% of their power into the suspension links (and bend them in 1000hp applications.

By changing the angle of the hubs you can increase or decrease anti-sqaut

Do a bit of googling on the matter as It may be easier with pictures.

Depending on your traction problems I would say there are numerous things you could do to fix the problem too.

If you want me to go into detail more just let me knw, Im at work atm
Gianni Matrogiannis
TryHard
nsw
SC400 V8

Posts: 255
Reg: 08-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Monday, April 20, 2009 - 06:19 pm, by:  Gianni Matrogiannis (Gianni) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

do they affect anything else. tyre wear or extra strain on components. whats the trade off. Sorry for all the questions im interested but i want to know what to expect
Dave Cazes
TryHard
sa
tt

Posts: 407
Reg: 08-2007

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Tuesday, April 21, 2009 - 12:00 pm, by:  Dave Cazes (Cazman) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

No other trade offs, all are written up the top, they are solid bushes but every otehr arm in our cars are anyway, its funny that the only, yes the ONLY arm in the car that doesnt runa ball joint is this arm. Ball joints/rose joints are much dearer to buy than rubber.

Even if you dont adjust the arm its still alot stiffer than stock. You will get less wheel hop and less alignment change when your suspension is compressing or loading during cornering.

If you were to leave them stock length you would see no disadvantages, you would get slightly more road noise, but its so minor you wont notice it, as the arm is still rubber mounted at the hub.
Gianni Matrogiannis
TryHard
nsw
SC400 V8

Posts: 256
Reg: 08-2005

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Tuesday, April 21, 2009 - 06:08 pm, by:  Gianni Matrogiannis (Gianni) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

well im in then put me down for a traction rod
Prem Ananth Ganesh
TryHard
Kuala Lumpur
Soarer (MZ10) & (JZZ30)

Posts: 111
Reg: 11-2006

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Monday, April 27, 2009 - 12:16 pm, by:  Prem Ananth Ganesh (Soarerlover) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Are the ikeya products good?
Costa Tsimiklis
Tinkerer
Victoria
TT 300rwkw

Posts: 96
Reg: 07-2008

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 09:58 pm, by:  Costa Tsimiklis (Driftshop) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ikeya are the market leaders in Japan and priced accordingly.

I still think that some of their products could be better. The D1 Soarer runs Ikeya Forumula products.
Dave Cazes
TryHard
SA
tt

Posts: 417
Reg: 08-2007

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!)

Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 10:03 am, by:  Dave Cazes (Cazman) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah as I said ein the other thread, Ikleya are the best, but way over priced.
Not worth it in my opinion

Add Your Message Here
Eye Candy
Click for full size
Bold text Italics Underline Center Text Upload photo from your hard drive Make a List Make a Table Make an Image Thumbnail Create a hyperlink Insert a clipart image Formatting Help
         

Username: Important Posting Information:
If asking a question, have you done a search to see if your question has already been answered?
Be aware that the use of SMS-speak eg "u" instead of "you" etc, will get your post deleted.
Password:
Enable HTML code in message
Automatically activate URLs in message

  Administration Administration      Log Out Log Out Previous Previous      Next Next