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Scott Wilkes
TryHard
Tasmania
92 TT Factory Manual

Posts: 351
Reg: 10-2008

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Saturday, April 04, 2009 - 10:33 pm, by:  Scott Wilkes (Scottywilkes) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

ive got the S15 rims back on now, 225 tyres

Continentals on the back, and michelins on the front, super quite, there 16 inch rims to.

Tell you what, the tyres on my good rims, Bridgestone S02s, and Continental Contisport contacts both ZR rated tyres, never ever let out the slightest screech, wheras the 225 tyres screach like buggery when spinning HAHA
David Vaughan
Goo Roo
NSW
V8 Ltd manual

Posts: 4256
Reg: 07-2005

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Sunday, April 05, 2009 - 05:32 pm, by:  David Vaughan (Davidv) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Pilot Preceda.

As I said earlier, if you are thinking of Michelin PS2, try Bridgestone RE-001. As a lifelong Michelin devotee, I am amazed at the quality of the new Bridgestone. It is far superior to the old SO-2. The one thing I do not know about it is tyre life.

Incidentally, Bobby, the Michelin PS2 beat the previous Bridgestone competitors (SO2, SO3) despite having harder rubber.
Bobby Green
TryHard
QLD
TT

Posts: 237
Reg: 09-2005

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Sunday, April 05, 2009 - 09:55 pm, by:  Bobby Green (Nash) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What's "beat" really mean though in relation to these magazine tests? Every car and set up will be different. And these are street tyres being driven on roads with varying camber and obstructions. There are so many factors involved that I think as long as you go with a model of tyre that has a compound that matches what you want out of the tyre (wear rate versus grip), with a high load rating and speed rating, for the best price, then you'll be doing alright.

I've heard good things about the pilot sports, if they last longer due to their harder compound then that's always a plus if they are priced near similarly performing competition.
Phil Gibson
Goo Roo
WA
'91 UZZ31 track bunky, '94 blk/blk UZZ31

Posts: 1414
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Monday, April 06, 2009 - 03:13 pm, by:  Phil Gibson (Sciflyer) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have a set of Yoko V103s on my road car, and on the track bunky Potenza RE01-Rs on the front and Kumho KU36s on teh rear

Although i like Yokohama tyres generally, the V103s i dont think are that great considering the price and the treadwear rating - they were considerably more expensive than the Kumho's yet have less grip in the dry at least, and comparable treadwear

Its early days for the Kumhos though but they seem to be pretty good. Those special deals on them that were advertised on a few forums were bloody good prices, i wish i'd got them for that much!

The Potenzas are undoubtedly the best of the bunch though which is not really surprising as the general opnion is they are one of the best 'street' tyres you can get.
Im impressed with them and would definately like to check out the new model
Ben Lipman
Goo Roo
NSW
Soarer TT manual

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Monday, April 06, 2009 - 06:48 pm, by:  Ben Lipman (Ben12a) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Bobby Green wrote on Saturday, April 04, 2009 - 08:55 pm:

The wider the tyre, the better they are able to dissipate heat, it has nothing to do with the contact patch, that remains unchanged regardless of the width of tyre you use.




Not having participated in this tyre debate, this comment intrigues me. How is it possible a 275 tyre has the same size contact patch as a 205 tyre? If this is indeed true, wouldn't V8 supercars, F1 and every other motorsport category run very narrow tyres to reap the rewards of lighter unsprung weight?

The heat thing I can understand, but how the contact patch remains unchanged regardless of tyre width has me puzzled.
Scott Wilkes
TryHard
Tasmania
92 TT Factory Manual

Posts: 360
Reg: 10-2008

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Monday, April 06, 2009 - 07:06 pm, by:  Scott Wilkes (Scottywilkes) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

got my tyres mounted today, il put them on the car tomorrow along with my new soarer mats and take it for a spin and see how i like them :-)
Damian Ware
DieHard
Victoria
UZZ32

Posts: 876
Reg: 10-2005

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Monday, April 06, 2009 - 07:36 pm, by:  Damian Ware (Frozenpod) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ben,

If the pressure applied on the tyre is the same (it is for cars if the only thing changed is the tyres) and the tyre pressure is the same the contact patch area is the same. Sure shape is different but the area is the same.

This change in shape can have its advantages but it also has its disadvantages and they need to be considered seriously when making rim/tyre choices.
David Vaughan
Goo Roo
NSW
V8 Ltd manual

Posts: 4259
Reg: 07-2005

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Monday, April 06, 2009 - 07:39 pm, by:  David Vaughan (Davidv) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The contact patch does not remain exactly the same. It remains substantially the same because the weight on each tyre is the same and deformation of the wider tyre is less to support the same weight. However, a radial tyre is not uniform in construction so the actual tyre deformation differs between profiles and widths.

Characteristic handling differences also arise based on the length/width ratio of the contact patch. A shorter and wider patch will feel sharper and will also be less forgiving at breakaway.
Damian Ware
DieHard
Victoria
UZZ32

Posts: 877
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Monday, April 06, 2009 - 07:43 pm, by:  Damian Ware (Frozenpod) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here you go,

http://autospeed.com/cms/A_0277/printArticle.html

Very basic introduction, have a search around on the web and or read some books everything will fall into place.
Bobby Green
TryHard
QLD
TT

Posts: 239
Reg: 09-2005

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Monday, April 06, 2009 - 07:53 pm, by:  Bobby Green (Nash) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ben, this article should help you out:

http://www.autospeed.com.au/cms/A_108915/article.html?popularArticle

The patch shape will certainly change but not so much its area. Area is determined by load weight on that tyre and the pressure of its inflation. Narrow tyres create a lot of side wall flex in getting their contact patch to the ground and necessitate harder compounds to cope with this flex. Wider, lower profile tyres will be able to run softer compounds and deal with the heat better. That's not to say all wide, low profile tyres are made of soft compounds (you get what you pay for) but the compounds can be softer than a narrow tyre with a large sidewall would allow.

Keep in mind the brands with good compounds and ring around to find the best price on that range of models. As I've said before, the V103's are oem on some Porsche Cayennes, 997's, Merc CL63 and Bentley Continental GTs, so there are deals to be had on these tyres and they are usually in stock. I had trouble trying to get some Toyo T1Rs, no one wanted to discount as they had to be ordered in the size I wanted and they had worse load ratings than the V103's to top it off.
Scott Wilkes
TryHard
Tasmania
92 TT Factory Manual

Posts: 362
Reg: 10-2008

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Monday, April 06, 2009 - 08:22 pm, by:  Scott Wilkes (Scottywilkes) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

what do people think of stretching tyres slightly to fit larger rims? Ive heard you get uneven wear characteristics, as the centre of the tyre dips from the stretching of the tyre.

Not going stretched tyres, allready got new tyres just wondering what people think
David Vaughan
Goo Roo
NSW
V8 Ltd manual

Posts: 4260
Reg: 07-2005

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Monday, April 06, 2009 - 08:46 pm, by:  David Vaughan (Davidv) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I agree with Dennis Jensen and not with Julian Edgar in that total area will change slightly, except not only with pressure but also with construction. Stiffness affects the equation of pressure, mass and area. Reductio ad absurdum, think of a solid steel tyre vs one made of bath sponge and you will see what I mean. Wall stiffness, even belt stiffness and compound all affect this a little. Wall stiffness can be affected by profile for a given construction.

Enough of the esoterica. Buy good tyres at what they cost and you can afford. There has been plenty of advice here indicating what is really good value.
Scott Wilkes
TryHard
Tasmania
92 TT Factory Manual

Posts: 364
Reg: 10-2008

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Monday, April 06, 2009 - 09:36 pm, by:  Scott Wilkes (Scottywilkes) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

ive allready bought tyres, Will find out how they go tomorrow. I got Maxxis MA-V1s, look like a great tyre. Cost was $1030 but i managed to get them down to $950 :-), not top of the range tyres but good enough for what im going to use them for

I agree that this is full of good information that can help a person. Any way of stickying or putting this in a area that wont dissapear in the pages of threads?
Damian Ware
DieHard
Victoria
UZZ32

Posts: 893
Reg: 10-2005

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Tuesday, April 14, 2009 - 01:38 pm, by:  Damian Ware (Frozenpod) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Saw this on the nissan forum thought it might be worth posting.

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/Tyres-used-rate-t72923.html&pid=4256835&mode=threaded&start= 800#entry4256835

Interesting to see the last placed road tyres Federals had the equal fastest lap??

Also interesting to see the F1's had better wet performance than dry.
Justin Camilleri
Goo Roo
QLD
Had a 85 MZ10, 92 TT, Now 91 TT

Posts: 1003
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Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 06:06 pm, by:  Justin Camilleri (Just) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well tell us Scott, how are they feeling?
David Vaughan
Goo Roo
NSW
V8 Ltd manual

Posts: 4290
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Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 06:40 pm, by:  David Vaughan (Davidv) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It seems to me that something is seriously wrong with a test if wet performance is better than dry, not just compared with other tyres but for a specific tyre. Really, what were they testing and how?
Damian Ware
DieHard
Victoria
UZZ32

Posts: 894
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Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 07:32 pm, by:  Damian Ware (Frozenpod) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

David I agree, I cant make any sense of it.

I don't know how they ranked the tyres either as the equal fastest tyre over the lap of oran park was ranked last.

I have never seen a tyre perform better in the wet than dry I think there is some serious issues with that tyre test.
Scott Wilkes
TryHard
Tasmania
92 TT Factory Manual

Posts: 411
Reg: 10-2008

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Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 08:15 pm, by:  Scott Wilkes (Scottywilkes) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Maxxis MAV1 tyres i got im quite happy with.

They have excellent grip, low noise, and great wet traction.

Only gripe i have is coming from $700 tyres the sidewalls of these combined with the higher tread they are not as direct as the old S02s and Continentals.

Grip is alot better, but instead of darting from side to side, it rolls slightly. Other than that there great.

Once the tread wears down a bit, and the tyres harden slightly it should be pretty much gone :-)
David Vaughan
Goo Roo
NSW
V8 Ltd manual

Posts: 4293
Reg: 07-2005

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Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 08:16 pm, by:  David Vaughan (Davidv) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Now that you mention it, I compared the Federal with the Pirelli, both being visible on screen at once. The Pirelli has better slalom speed, better dry braking, the same lateral G, significantly higher apex speed, is also equal or better in all wet parameters, yet was 0.4 seconds slower in total lap time. How, or why?
Peter Nitschke
Junk Filterer
South Australia
UZZ30 UZZ31

Posts: 10504
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Friday, April 17, 2009 - 11:10 pm, by:  Peter Nitschke (Pen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Less grip under acceleration?
David Vaughan
Goo Roo
NSW
V8 Ltd manual

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Saturday, April 18, 2009 - 07:05 am, by:  David Vaughan (Davidv) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It is the one thing not measured, true. Seems a slim margin on to overwhelm all of the other factors even though most of your time is spent accelerating on a track, but it is the single least important grip factor on a public road, to the point of practical irrelevance.
Robert Pressnell
Tinkerer
Victoria
V8

Posts: 33
Reg: 11-2008

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Sunday, July 05, 2009 - 10:31 pm, by:  Robert Pressnell (Bob_pressnell) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I brought aset bof new tyres for the front of my GT-L and i get x2 245/35R17.I just paid out aheap of bills and with just opening my business just weeks before this.I thought i'd go alittle cheaper on my tyres and when i replace rears in acouple of months replace the fronts.Anyway the bloke at the Tyre place showed me afew differant tyres and gave me the prices.Anyway the x2 tyres i choose were $130 each.Then when we where walking back out of the workshop for me to bring the car in.And just inside the door he had afew sets of rims with tyres set up on show all rims where top of the rage rims.Except for one second hand set of ROH rims they where in top condition for sercond hand anyway.So after i drove my car in we had to wait for his worker as i suppose he dont like getting dirty.So we are having a ciggie at the front rollor door then he says see those ROH Wheels you can have those tyres for $95ech he said they where just as good as the ones i was buying useally they are $145each.But the wheels were brought in acouple of months ago for the tyres to be fitted but no one ever showed up for them and phones were disconnected he said so could'nt get in contact.So the wheels have been sitting there with the tyres on for acouple of months and thats why he was selling them at that price.Moral to the story i brought the x2 tyres for $95each and they make abit of noise so lesson learnt yet again.The reason i brought the x2 new tyres is because aweek before that i got a set of brandnew Dunlop or Bridgestone cant remmember they were made in Germany anyway and was 1 of the above brand.Anyway they were brandnew got them at a steal they are nice chunky looking tyres.Anyway my frontend felt f#@*ED well i find out that they are'nt Legal in Australia as they are SNOW tyres.Have to say it's been a fight but i finally got refunded for the tyres.No more second hand,cheap brandnew tyres nothing but thr best for now on.
David Grab
Goo Roo
SA
T78

Posts: 1573
Reg: 01-2008

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Sunday, July 05, 2009 - 10:44 pm, by:  David Grab (Blastedbyasoarer) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

If you want an awesome tyre that its cheap go the Khumo KU36, heaps of people recommend them and ill be trying them when i need new tyres. Normally i use Hankook Ventus RS-2, there are like 11 variations of them but i go the top spec. About $465 a tyre but highly recommended, awesome grip in all conditions. Wear isnt that bad either with around 15,000kms-20,000kms life span.
Adam Lonergan
DieHard
Victoria
UZZ32 #369 (V8)

Posts: 927
Reg: 08-2005

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Monday, July 06, 2009 - 07:06 am, by:  Adam Lonergan (Alchemistal) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

David I have once off access to cheap new Ventus RS-2's if you're interested.
Damian Ware
Goo Roo
Victoria
UZZ32

Posts: 1008
Reg: 10-2005

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Monday, July 06, 2009 - 09:33 am, by:  Damian Ware (Frozenpod) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I wouldn't bother the the RS-2's old tyre, design for dry use which has poor wet grip. It was ok when it was first released but it is now very poor in comparsion to other options. Including the new RS-3.

The KU36's do look like a great tyre for dry weather. Supposed to be a bit noisy and not good on the edge in wet conditions.

I think bang for buck KU36 is very attractive.
Adam Lonergan
DieHard
Victoria
UZZ32 #369 (V8)

Posts: 928
Reg: 08-2005

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Monday, July 06, 2009 - 09:57 am, by:  Adam Lonergan (Alchemistal) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Haven't bothered to confirm yet but I believe these are half price and include free delivery Melbourne wide (other areas/cities by neg).
Matthew Sharpe
Goo Roo
North Island
JZZ31

Posts: 4444
Reg: 10-2005

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Monday, July 06, 2009 - 11:10 am, by:  Matthew Sharpe (Madmatt) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Indeed, I hate my RS-2's - would be fantastic in a dry climate, but I live in NZ, so they suck 60% of the time - can't wait to be rid of them - they are down to about 3mm now so not long to go. The Yoko A-Drive's I have on the front are an awesome all-weather tyre at a good price.
Matt Newman
TryHard
QLD
soarer tt

Posts: 114
Reg: 11-2007

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Monday, July 06, 2009 - 12:12 pm, by:  Matt Newman (Soarersrock) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i'm really surprised that even though this thread is massive there has been no mention of toyo proxies 4's. i have them all round on my TT and i haven't had a problem with them and i got them for about $170 per tyre for 235/45/17 just my thoughts though

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