| Author |
Message |
Mark Donovan
Tinkerer
n/a
Soarer V8 Limited
Posts: 12
Reg: 07-2005
|
Add me to the list of UZZ31 owners whose airbag suspension has crapped out. My whole left side has been almost 2 inches lower than the drivers side for the last 6- 9 months.
Took it to Pedders this morning and their susp. guy pretty much confirmed my worst fears that the airbags were on their last legs, with the left front leak most likely coming from near the top of the bag (the presence of warm, indirect air around the top of the airbag indicates this?) He took the cover off the top of the strut in the engine bay and sprayed water on it to look for an obvious air leak, as well as on the compressor, but nothing there.
Also found that my right front sway bar had completely ripped free from the chassis frame rail which will have to be welded to a plate and welded back on. I wish I knew alot more about cars so that I could have known about or felt that sooner.
Anyway, the Pedders quote for replacing all airbag struts with their product for the Soarer came to NZ$2,181 (not including the top mounts which they're waiting on a price for).
On the way home I pretty much decided to do away with the airbag suspension and go ahead with the more common shocks and springs. I've always thought the airbag suspension was a great feature but thinking on it, it has only given me headaches- driving in the city streets is like driving across exposed railway tracks; having to worry about the TEMS switch not being turned off being jacked up etc.. Simply put, it's only ever been comfortable when I'm cruising on long trips on good roads.
So...now I've decided to rip all that stuff out, would you guys recommend I go with what Pedders offer or is there an alternative set of shocks I should be looking at now I've got the opportunity?
Do they also rip out the compressors? I'm assuming there's one for each strut? |
Peter Nitschke
JunkFilterer
South Australia
GT4.0 V8
Posts: 2510
Reg: 11-2004
|
Mark, airbags are supposed to give a smooth ride on rough roads. Your experience has probably been on stuffed bags hence the bad ride. See if you can ride in one with good bas before making a decision.
There is only a single pump. |
Mark Donovan
Tinkerer
n/a
Soarer V8 Limited
Posts: 14
Reg: 07-2005
|
Thanks, Peter but if I have to replace, or rebuild, one strut, I would want to do all of them at the same time which is going to be prohibitively expensive. Whilst Neil's price of A$880 is alot more affordable than getting them through Toyota, the cost of 4 of those, plus shipping, plus labour to fit them puts it out of my price range and still does not alleviate me of the worries above. Also finding someone in Auckland who seriously knows their stuff with Toyotas / Soarers has so far proved a hard task. |
Mark Donovan
Tinkerer
n/a
Soarer V8 Limited
Posts: 16
Reg: 07-2005
|
OK guys, I'm replacing the bags with coils, but I'm not sure on a couple of things. Obviously the Height and TEMS switches will cease to function but what about the PWR/ECT switch and it's effect on the suspension?
Can I expect to see error codes pop up on the dash or EMV when it finds the struts don't respond?
I'd really appreciate any feedback from anyone else who has replaced their bags with coils and what they might now recommend to someone following in their tracks.
The haemorrhaging of cash begins after Christmas so I will be more active on the board from now on, trying to glean as much info as possible. I expect to be doing the following all at the same time:
- install coils (coilovers?)
- fix & reattach r.h. front sway bar
- replace brake pads
- install braided brake lines (bleed lines etc)
- replace rocker cover gasket
- replace trans. pan gasket
- replace transmission oil
I only need the one kidney anyway. |
Don Bagnall
Moderator
New Zealand
1991 UZZ30 GT4.0 V8
Posts: 1743
Reg: 05-2005
|
Sounds like HEAPS of fun (not)  |
David Vaughan
DieHard
ACT
Soarer GT-L (4.0 V8) Lexus is300 (3.0 VVT-i 6)
Posts: 917
Reg: 07-2005
|
I can tell you that the PWR/ECT switch has no effect on the suspension of a V8 Limited but not about anything else because I replaced my old air struts with new air struts. A pity about the money side because you are throwing away a great ride you never knew you had. Perhaps that makes it easier  |
Peter Nitschke
JunkFilterer
South Australia
GT4.0 V8
Posts: 2680
Reg: 11-2004
|
http://soarercentral.com/sc-forum/messages/30604/14108.html |
Mark Donovan
Tinkerer
n/a
Soarer V8 Limited
Posts: 17
Reg: 07-2005
|
thanks for the link, Peter. David, you're right. Unfortunately I know of no one else in Auckland with a UZ31 to ask for a demo ride. |
Darryn Dewar
TryHard
Gisborne
UZZ30 Soarer
Posts: 155
Reg: 09-2005
|
Was up your way during the weekend just gone, I would've offered you a ride in my 30 to put you off Coils if I'd known Mark  |
Mark Donovan
Tinkerer
n/a
Soarer V8 Limited
Posts: 18
Reg: 07-2005
|
Nevermind, Darryn. Are you serious about your coils, or is that just because they are compressed?
At the moment, it looks like Pedders offer the best deal but I've been doing reading when time permits to see what other coil options I have and whether I would be better going with another make/brand. I don't want to find out that Pedders are run of the mill generic shocks which I regret having purchased 3 months down the track. |
Adam Foster
TryHard
SA
SC400 Limited GT
Posts: 174
Reg: 07-2005
|
your choices in brands are D2, Tein, Cusco, Koni, Bilstein, Jic, Advox, Zeal, HKS, and i think apexi also make some as well, so theres alot to chose from. |
Darryn Dewar
TryHard
Gisborne
UZZ30 Soarer
Posts: 156
Reg: 09-2005
|
Heh, I'm just stirring, my suspension is pretty shot, and needs some money thrown at it when time allows |
David Vaughan
DieHard
ACT
Soarer GT-L (4.0 V8) Lexus is300 (3.0 VVT-i 6)
Posts: 930
Reg: 07-2005
|
Which is part of the point. Good shocks and springs are going to cost you anyway. The bloke at the local Pedders where I had my air struts tested before I replaced them said to me that using coils and springs was a cheaper option than new airs but they had already done a car in Canberra and in his opinion driving it, the result was a poor ride after paying over $2000. He was arguing that the choice of wire or air was budgetary and that you would get what you paid for. You could do well with wire but you would pay for the quality of springs and shocks to achieve it. Remember that he knew he would not be selling me the air struts.
I reiterate that I am providing other people's opinions and my biasses, not personal experience in relation to coil-sprung Soarers but I do currently own another car with coils and the Soarer is the second air-sprung car which I have owned. For large bumps the difference is extraordinary but for handling hard coils will be much stiffer than the Soarer's comparatively soft air system.
Is there anyone here who has used the track-day setting on a V8 Ltd and can speak for the effect on large vs small bumps? |
Damien Smith
TryHard
NSW
Manual UZZ31
Posts: 254
Reg: 07-2005
|
I had airbags with Whiteline swaybars and did a trackday with that setup (using the trackday setting) which worked very well. I now have coilovers but would have gone with new airbags if my car was a daily driver as the trackday setting makes them almost as stiff as moderate coilovers.
I've heard a lot of good things about HKS Hipermax II for comfort and performance but again, they're not a budget item. |
Mark Donovan
Tinkerer
n/a
Soarer V8 Limited
Posts: 19
Reg: 07-2005
|
David, when you say the difference is extraordinary, I take it you mean the airbags are far superior to any coil set-up when hitting large bumps? This would tend to suggest that my airbag suspension has been crap since the day I bought it- I have always had a thud when driving over catseyes, for example.
Is it feasible that the airbag suspension could be reinstalled at a later stage, providing all necessary parts are retained (pump etc.)i.e. is it possible to remove the airbag suspension system intact so that it can be reinstalled later on, or does removing it preclude this option?
I can definitely see myself affording 4 new struts from Rush Imports in about 18 months, but right now I have the budget for what I've been quoted on coils. I'll certainly be a happy camper if I can reinstall airbags at a later date, but then it will be a case of finding someone who knows how to do it! Anyone fancy a paid holiday to NZ for a few days?! |
Damien Smith
TryHard
NSW
Manual UZZ31
Posts: 257
Reg: 07-2005
|
Mark, you could easily go back to airbags later if need be and you could do it all yourself. You just need to unplug the suspension ECU (behind the panel next to the rear seat on the passenger side) while running coils. For good measure also remove the 60amp fuse for the air pump in the fuse box in the engine bay. |
Peter Nitschke
JunkFilterer
South Australia
GT4.0 V8
Posts: 2708
Reg: 11-2004
|
What about replace the worst 2 now, then do the other 2 when the dollars have flowed in?
No wastage  |
David Vaughan
DieHard
ACT
Soarer GT-L (4.0 V8) Lexus is300 (3.0 VVT-i 6)
Posts: 936
Reg: 07-2005
|
In answer to most of your questions, what ^ lot said.
On the "extraordinary", if you mean those catseyes which are mounted on a small block to stand up from the road by a centimetre or so then yes, they would be examples. By large bumps I mean speed humps, bumps in corners, things which cause a bit of suspension travel rather than a fractional ripple. In fact, I would say an air system is no better than a coil system over very small ripples, most of the compliance being in the tyres anyway for those sorts of things. Changing it to soft smooths out the ripples a bit.
I have written before somewhere about three tests for shot struts but you know yours are gone anyway. You were probably getting skipping when you touched a ripple accelerating in a corner and the wheels coming down with a crash on the down-side of a short speed hump. |
Mark Donovan
Tinkerer
n/a
Soarer V8 Limited
Posts: 20
Reg: 07-2005
|
Thanks for the tips- certainly glad to hear that the airbags can go back in later with no major dramas.
I had thought to put two new bags in but really would want to do all four at the same time- that's just how I feel about these sorts of things- get them all done at the same time, don't have to worry about forgetting which are the new ones, which ones had the problem etc.. I also will be putting in new bushes so all four corners will be getting attention anyway when the work gets done.
Getting another quote for coils tomorrow morning in Newmarket. |
Don Bagnall
Moderator
New Zealand
1991 UZZ30 GT4.0 V8
Posts: 1809
Reg: 05-2005
|
 |
Mark Paddick
Goo Roo
ACT
Soarer UZZ31
Posts: 919
Reg: 07-2005
|
For just over AU$3k I put 4 brand new airbag struts in.
The difference over the 15 year old struts is astonishing and well worth it.
It looks like the coils will cost you nearly as much. I wouldn't do it. |
David Vaughan
DieHard
ACT
Soarer GT-L (4.0 V8) Lexus is300 (3.0 VVT-i 6)
Posts: 964
Reg: 07-2005
|
|
Don Bagnall
Moderator
New Zealand
1991 UZZ30 GT4.0 V8
Posts: 1812
Reg: 05-2005
|
Mark D., I would SERIOUSLY advise AGAINST a change to coils...........KEEP IT ORIGINAL!, you WILL thank us later on.
 |
Mark Donovan
Tinkerer
n/a
Soarer V8 Limited
Posts: 21
Reg: 07-2005
|
Arrrrgggh!!!!! I'm going insane in the membrane!! Indecisions, indecisions! Reading the above I want to both laugh and scream at the same time.
Alright, that's it. I'm emailing Neil. |
Mark Paddick
Goo Roo
ACT
Soarer UZZ31
Posts: 928
Reg: 07-2005
|
That's the best idea yet! |
Don Bagnall
Moderator
New Zealand
1991 UZZ30 GT4.0 V8
Posts: 1834
Reg: 05-2005
|
Top man Mark, I've always spoken well of you .
Between the lot of us, we should be able to keep you broke BUT happy for some time to come |
Damien Smith
TryHard
NSW
Manual UZZ31
Posts: 268
Reg: 07-2005
|
Not sure how your insurance works in NZ but if it's insured for market value coilovers will reduce the value of the car and hence your pay out if it gets written off. |
Darryn Dewar
TryHard
Gisborne
UZZ30 Soarer
Posts: 163
Reg: 09-2005
|
Coilovers generally don't devalue the car over here (more often add value to the car) but they count as a fairly high risk mod (Why would you install coilovers for day to day driving) and reflect as such in your premiums/excess.....
They also need to be certified by a VTNZ authorised agent which'll cost you to the tune of $300-500 with the height stamped on the cert plate (They're looking at introducing it to be certified within a range) so if you get caught out with no cert, or if you're outside the height restrictions of your cert, your insurance policy generally isn't worth squat. |
Mark Donovan
Tinkerer
n/a
Soarer V8 Limited
Posts: 22
Reg: 07-2005
|
New airbags ordered |
Previous
