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Tai Johnsen
DieHard
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 804
Reg: 04-2006

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Monday, July 12, 2010 - 07:48 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I wanted to firm up my gear lever shift feel and thought i could just replace the bush like in this pic



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But mine is a 94 model, and looks like this one..


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Where the hell is the bush?

2nd is a real dog to get when cold, but gets better as it warms up, but still pretty notchy... As far as I know it has the redline lightweight shock proof in it already..

The clutch comes out pretty late too... Could this case any of the symptoms?

Cheers,
TJ
Scott Wilkes
Goo Roo
Tasmania
92 TT Factory Manual, 70 HG GTS Monaro

Posts: 1658
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Monday, July 12, 2010 - 08:48 pm, by:  Scott Wilkes (Scottywilkes) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

if the redline has been in there for quite some time, it has the GL5 type oil in it. Alot of people have been having problems with the shockproof glazing up the synchros and causing crap changes. If you want to use redline use the MT90 as its GL4 type oil and dosnt create the same problems that the shockproof does.
Matt Petersen
DieHard
NA
V8

Posts: 759
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Tuesday, July 13, 2010 - 06:11 am, by:  Matt Petersen (Mattmannz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Check for play in the entire rear shift lever housing. There are three bushes that hold the assembly against the gearbox and these do wear over time and create a bit of play.

I had a machinist spin up some brass bushes and it's nice and solid now.

Matt.
Tai Johnsen
DieHard
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 805
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Tuesday, July 13, 2010 - 08:20 am, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks guys,

Is there a way to un-glaze them? I have heard of running kero or diesel for a very short time and run through the gears.... Or ATF?

Matt, are you able to show me which bushes?

This is the only part that is called a bush that I can see...


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Matt Petersen
DieHard
NA
V8

Posts: 761
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Tuesday, July 13, 2010 - 09:54 am, by:  Matt Petersen (Mattmannz) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

33575A and B are the bits that I replaced

Cheers
Jeff Bedsor
DieHard
QLD
TT

Posts: 867
Reg: 10-2006

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Tuesday, July 13, 2010 - 10:09 am, by:  Jeff Bedsor (Jeff_bedsor) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

As Scott said, get rid of the Redline, it can "go off" after 10,000 k's or less. I switched to Motul when I had my WRX and had no further problems with notchy changes.
James Harris
Goo Roo
QLD
GT Starlet

Posts: 3537
Reg: 07-2005

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Tuesday, July 13, 2010 - 12:22 pm, by:  James Harris (Haro) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

what the sh1t!?!? I didnt realise you were/are back in the game Tai !

Nice work brother! Im still lingering around (clearly) even thought I had a GT Starlet now haha.

Check the events section - QLD Cruise coming up !
I have been eyeing off a Red VVTi 98 Manual in NSW for a couple of weeks now.... but its SOO FAAAARR AWWAAAAAYY

Maybe ill just buy a Volvo C70 Convertible haha
Tai Johnsen
DieHard
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 806
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Tuesday, July 13, 2010 - 12:58 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks for the info Matt and Jeff..

James mate! Yeah, I decided to convert to the TT dark side and ditch the automagic :-) I've only been back a few weeks.. I'm living up in Kingaroy for the moment (peanut country) at a motorbike shop.

Nice work on the starlet! I have seen one do a 10sec pass at Willowbank

Go the red rocket man! I bought mine from Melb so quit ya whinging :-)
Tai Johnsen
DieHard
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

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Tuesday, July 13, 2010 - 01:00 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Matt
Check for play in the entire rear shift lever housing.

Yup, it's loose as a goose...}
Damian Ware
Goo Roo
Victoria
UZZ32

Posts: 1610
Reg: 10-2005

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Tuesday, July 13, 2010 - 01:38 pm, by:  Damian Ware (Frozenpod) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


Jeff Bedsor wrote on Tuesday, July 13, 2010 - 10:09 am:

As Scott said, get rid of the Redline, it can "go off" after 10,000 k's or less. I switched to Motul when I had my WRX and had no further problems with notchy changes.




I have heard this a few times but I have also heard bucket loads of reports that say otherwise.

Redline claim the LWSP will last for 200,000km.
LWSP is thinner than MTL90 from the redlines specs.

LWSP should prevent glazing of the synchros, in my experience the thinner the oil the better in terms of shift quality and not glazing synchros but too thin and it will not provide enough lubrication for bearings and the gear set.

If that happens in reality I don't know I haven't had any personal experience with LWSP.

One of the best manuals I have driven used ATF it was used for 6 track days per year for 2 years and still drove very well before being replaced.
Jeff Bedsor
DieHard
QLD
TT

Posts: 868
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Tuesday, July 13, 2010 - 02:11 pm, by:  Jeff Bedsor (Jeff_bedsor) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Everyone raves about the redline LWSP, I know from my own experience and that of many of the local WRX guys that it fails and the shifts go notchy again after about 10,000K's. You pay something like $170 for 4 litres of the stuff and it doesn't last 10,000 km's, not good. Many instances were reported to the distributors and nothing was done. Do a search on Rexnet if you want some further info/ proof.
James Harris
Goo Roo
QLD
GT Starlet

Posts: 3540
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Wednesday, July 14, 2010 - 02:12 pm, by:  James Harris (Haro) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ooh Kingaroy hey ! Ive been out that a few times with the Army and on nice long cruises.

got some lovely surrounds thats for sure. So you are working in a Bike shop now ? No more geek'n it up?

Yeh I really do like that Red one.... but it doesnt have a LSD :-(

Ill keep you posted haha
Tai Johnsen
DieHard
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 809
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Wednesday, July 14, 2010 - 05:50 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Nah, not much geeking at all these days :-) I am hoping to become an aircraft maintenance engineer for QANTAS in the near future, so it's just an in-between job for me...

Don't let an LSD hold you back from a vvt manual dude!!

I just got back from doing an ECU reset...

I did it on my V8 and honestly didn't notice any difference at all... Not so with the TT gotta hang on now!
Tai Johnsen
DieHard
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 810
Reg: 04-2006

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Wednesday, July 14, 2010 - 05:52 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Back to the topic, I might try some ATF for a little bit coz it's cheap and see if it makes a difference and try to get a hold of some bushes.

Thanks for the feedback guys!
James Harris
Goo Roo
QLD
GT Starlet

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Wednesday, July 14, 2010 - 09:20 pm, by:  James Harris (Haro) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeh using ATF in manuals is pretty old school... i know of a few folk who use a 50/50 mix of the stuff in their notchy toyota boxes.

And being cheap is a nice change !
Damian Ware
Goo Roo
Victoria
UZZ32

Posts: 1616
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Thursday, July 15, 2010 - 01:11 am, by:  Damian Ware (Frozenpod) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Fair enough Jeff, perhaps elcheapo mineral gear oil mixed with ATF is the way to go and change it regularly.
Costa Tsimiklis
DieHard
Victoria
386.2 rwkw Soon T51R or GT4094 :-O

Posts: 905
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Sunday, September 05, 2010 - 11:41 pm, by:  Costa Tsimiklis (Driftshop) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Redline heavy shock proof here, has been in the car for over 25,000kms.

Only grip, its a bit notchy 1-2 and 2-1 for the first 5 mins if its driven straight from cold. Other than that..... best gear box oil for high powered soarers and especially with a 94 style box with remote shifter - very easy to fast shift gears up and down once the GB oil is warm.

MT90 is great as well, but does not offer the performance protection as shock proof does.
Tai Johnsen
DieHard
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

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Tuesday, September 07, 2010 - 09:54 am, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

OK, so i replaced 33575A and B and it did seem to make a little difference to the shifter play, but not much... should I change this one next?


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I notice the same cold issues you have Costa but mine continues to give grief 1-2 feeling "notchy" and 2-3 trying to "kick" the lever when shifting up into 3rd..
Costa Tsimiklis
Goo Roo
Victoria
386.2 rwkw Soon T51R or GT4094 :-O

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Thursday, October 28, 2010 - 01:52 am, by:  Costa Tsimiklis (Driftshop) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The situation with the Redline Shock Proof oils is that they have solid particles suspended in the oil. Sometimes these particles can get stuck in the needle rollers and/or synchro hub surfaces where it it connected on the gear. The synchro works by braking its speed due to its conical design and matching the speed of the other gear for a smooth change.

Redline when cold is always a bit notchy, goes away when the temp gets to half.

I would recommend filling the gearbox with diesel or kero, and run it through the gears on jack stands/hoist. Flush it a few times, then add in a running in engine oil. Run it again and then drain. Add the oil you want if it is a special blend. If the oil is not special , you can skip the running in oil part and just add in the general oil after all the diesel or kero is out.

Blowing compressed air in the gearbox can also dry it out quicker, but do not pressurize the box as it will make the front/rear seals leak.

Failing that, our synchros could just be f.ucked and no oil will fix that :/
Tazo Chitidze
Tinkerer
georgia
2.5 turbo

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Saturday, February 16, 2013 - 08:21 pm, by:  Tazo Chitidze (Tazo) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

which oil ie best redline mt90 or motul 300 gear oil for r154 ?
Matt Newman
DieHard
QLD
soarer tt

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Saturday, February 16, 2013 - 09:55 pm, by:  Matt Newman (Soarersrock) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Tazo when i got my r154 checked and rebuilt the owner of the very reputable shop recommended a 75w 90 mineral oil for it. and suggested not to use synthetic oil when i asked about them.
Shane Haverkamp
DieHard
nsw
soarer TT

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Saturday, February 16, 2013 - 11:22 pm, by:  Shane Haverkamp (Havabeer) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i would have thought "knothcy" shifts would be more a mechanical problem (bearing wear) more then anything, aka something an oil or oil additive can't solve.

i know for a fact my first gear takes off and knotces and shakes all over the place most likely due to a thrust washer failure commmon among R154's

realistically i'd drain about 500ml if not all the fluid out and look at it, if there's shiny gold looking flakes in it at all it means your gears and bearings are wearing which is something no matter what you add to your oil you can't fix with out physically changing the bearings and gears.

if you want to look up why gear changes should be smooth look at the "oil wedge principal" and go from there
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

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Sunday, February 17, 2013 - 08:09 am, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I had my gearbox pulled down and the thrust washer and retainer replaced with the Marlin Crawler parts.

The guy knew the gearbox inside and out and said Castrol VMX 80 is what these boxes like and to change it every year.
Shane Haverkamp
DieHard
nsw
soarer TT

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Sunday, February 17, 2013 - 09:43 am, by:  Shane Haverkamp (Havabeer) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

do you mind if i ask how much that cost tai?
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

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Sunday, February 17, 2013 - 02:26 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

One place quoted $450, the other $650. I went with the more expensive guy because he was a gearbox specialist and new the box well.
Ali Saeed
Goo Roo
WA
'97 JZZ30, '12 ZN6

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Sunday, February 17, 2013 - 06:00 pm, by:  Ali Saeed (Ali) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Tai is that $650 including gearbox removal? and were any synchros changed?
Tai Johnsen
Goo Roo
QLD
JZZ30 Pov Manual LSD & black!

Posts: 1319
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Monday, February 18, 2013 - 07:00 pm, by:  Tai Johnsen (Privatejohnsen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Nope, I removed the gearbox and dropped it off..

The original synchro's had heaps of meat on them and were lapped onto their mating gear.

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