Thursday, May 19, 2011 - 10:48 pm, by: Daniel Clarke(Dieseltrain)
No point having seperate wastegate sections unless they are at least 250mm long and then merge . Otherwise it may as well be 1 large opening .
As long as they fit well and arent warped , then they should flow better than the stock thing for sure .
Im not a welder , but i know Jeff is and if he questions it visibly , then must be a bit dodgy though . I mean , Jeff aint no 19 yr old blowing wind up your A$$ Christian . He voices his concerns for a reason
Friday, May 20, 2011 - 05:50 pm, by: Christian Perez(Chrisperez)
Daniel that's fine champ, I have taken what jeff says onboard.
as soon as I try them out I will make my mind up.
Most ppl on here do have good points and they make valid points. Though I have seen a lot of ppl that talk •••• cause they saw it somewhere else or heard it somewhere else. they just preach someone else's bullshit.
I have been modifying turbo cars for awhile and have had and seen good and bad jobs, just cause it don't look like the best does not mean it dosen't work. The dumps I had on my 200sx looked great and I paid top bloody dollar. Did they leak yes.
Anyway guys i totally understand where everyone is coming from so I took the innitiative and got a set, if they are •••• so be it. Was not a huge investment anyway
If they turn out to be good then lucky me.
See ya all on the next cruze fellas, feel free to ask me about the dumps. I'm open and honest.
By the way when is the next cruze? I got a few mates in none soarer cars that want to join in.
Thanks Eric you sold the beast and now you have to jump in with me lol
I want to know what the separated wastegate idea does, does it help for a smoother flow? I too was thinking just having a baffle that seprates it wouldn't do nothing wouldn't they have to be separated, I remember Lews very old ones were separated but apparently they take a very long time to make with separated tubes for the waste gates.
I think Lew said the time to get back on boost after gear changes is quicker so i take it better response.
Yeah ok I understand, but maybe better flow and less turbulence once the waste gates have opened, guess it must help since there are lots of exhausts out there with separated wastegate pipe, I guess if we want the "Ultimate Dumps" they should be separated wastegate type to extract the most out of our twins.
Monday, May 23, 2011 - 11:43 am, by: Brett Harrison(Bretto)
The best dumps Ive seen are the one that Evan from PSI made back in the Sin City soarer articles. These were separated, but used one large pipe, with a divider, that smoothed flow and merged WG and exhaust gases with out creating unnecessary turbulence.
Monday, May 23, 2011 - 07:38 pm, by: George Funa(Fun001)
Boris Siljanoski wrote on Monday, May 23, 2011 - 07:13 pm:
Jeff not so much the Dyno numbers, but how the car drives and responds. I guess Lew will have more info on this since he has tried it out.
Hey Boris, Both Daniel and Jeff not only have the Dyno numbers, they also have some awesome quarter mile numbers. There is a very small percentage of street cars that run in the 11's
Having said that, modifying your car with an exhaust/dumps effect the way the car drives and responds. In my case my car lost a bit down low but gained heaps mid range and top end. Regardless you get used to it the way the power is delivered.
There is an exhaust manufacturer called SMB exhaust at Ingelburn. These guys make exhausts and dumps for numerous makes and models. I reckon they could make dumps if there were enough people interested. At least they would be great quality
Monday, May 23, 2011 - 08:51 pm, by: kurt atzmuller(Kurt)
Hey Guy's it's Kurt here finally on soarer central and i must say it's been interesting reading over the past week or so. Some good, some not so. Lucky i got broad shoulder's! Well you just can't please everyone i suppose, and everyone is entitled to their own opinion! Who would have thought that putting an item i had lying around in my shed on ebay would have started all this. A bit over the top i agree!
Tuesday, May 24, 2011 - 07:20 am, by: Jeff Bedsor(Jeff_bedsor)
I don't think the thread or my comments are over the top at all. I am just trying to get people see that we don't have to accept shoddy workmanship that will ultimately cost them money and time wasted. David, from your comments I can tell that you have never done any fab work and have never touched a welder yourself and probably have not played around with the dumps and turbos on a Soarer or anything else.
David Henderson wrote on Monday, May 23, 2011 - 07:27 pm:
The parts look beefy and if they're straight and fit well, as well as cheap then what's to loose?
That's the problem, there is so much weld in them that there is no way they will fit and I am fairly sure Kurt said that they haven't been fitted up.
Tuesday, May 24, 2011 - 05:34 pm, by: Kurt Atzmuller(Kurt)
They have been bolted onto turbo's and manifold's and sat in an engine bay to check everything. You are wrong. I just haven't finished the whole job and started the car. This weekend if all goes well i'll have my car running. You are aware that these pipe's are made of 3.5mm steam pipe and are mig welded and not a thin tig weld? It seem's like a lot of people have had problem's with cracking dump's so i used chunky steam pipe and nice big welds for strength. Steam pipe is used by performance shop's and even 6-boost to make there turbo manifold's because of it's strenght under pressure. It won't be under anywhere near the stress in a dump pipe situation. If i used light exhaust pipe like all the other's they would crack like all the other's. The one Christian has weighs 1 kilo more than the cast peice and engine pipe it replace's. It'll be strong enough, even the 3 inch pipe is 2mm thick. And your right Jeff you don't have to accept so called shoddy workmanship, whatever you choose to do is totally your own choice!
Tuesday, May 24, 2011 - 07:21 pm, by: Matt Newman(Soarersrock)
right Kurt heres a bit of info for you if your talking about any steam line let alone "high pressure" that ONLY stick or tig is able to be used and thats for a few reasons 1) mig cold laps easily. 2) its a porous weld. 3) it can be brittle.
and as for your "steam pipe" your only using SCH40 true steam pipe is SCH80 MINIUM. now as for big welds you SHOULD know that just because a weld is large does not mean it will do its job. i also wonder if you have the knowledge of how to prep M/S pipework, because looking at the pictures i would say no. and as for the "thin tig" i can achieve a better stronger less crack prone weld about a quarter of the size of your welds. my view is you can't tig or stick weld anyone can use a mig, but its an art to use it well. go to tafe and learn to tig and then trot down to the welding supplies and buy a small mid range tig welder that goes to 180A or so and make a quality product instead of the •••• your offering! but hey what would i know im just a fitter
Tuesday, May 24, 2011 - 08:34 pm, by: Jeff Bedsor(Jeff_bedsor)
Well said Matt, at least there is someone else on here that knows what they're talking about with welding. Kurt - where do I start? You obviously haven't got a clue what your talking about, going by your theory it would be better to use a 75mm dia 12mm wall thickness pipe than normal exhaust pipe. Yeah sure.
Matt Newman wrote on Tuesday, May 24, 2011 - 07:21 pm:
Steam pipe is used by performance shop's and even 6-boost to make there turbo manifold's because of it's strenght under pressure.
Steam pipe will take up to a couple of thousand psi, what does a dump pipe hold 20-30 psi max, or less as the exhaust is open. Mate, seriously you are full of it. I didn't really care that you were selling your crappy home made, ugly as sin dump pipe on Ebay. But one of the guys said you were going to start making them to sell was what got me going. If you can produce a dump pipe that is fabricated well, is welded half decently(which most aren't)I wouldn't have a problem saying good things about them. But until that happens I'll continue to say that they are crap. BTW what do you do for a job, you obviously aren't a Boilermaker or a welder.
Wednesday, May 25, 2011 - 09:40 am, by: Brett Harrison(Bretto)
Kurt, points for giving it a go.
But I think you can make the two turbos merge with simple mandrel bends. No need for all that weld material, the parent metal would have well and truly had a workout.
Just try and keep it as simple as possible, less welds, is better
Wednesday, May 25, 2011 - 09:11 pm, by: Ian Clifford(Fezwa)
brett you are very right. i made my own set for my hilux using three tight 2.5 inch 90 bends and pipe i also did them about half a yr ago at tafe as my first tig job they look ugly compared to my tig work now. and kurt what jeff and matt are saying is very true take it as advice. i have seen plenty of mainfolds from a performance shop using both steam and thin wall also testing in tuned lenght and spag mainfolds.
Boris Siljanoski wrote on Wednesday, May 25, 2011 - 11:05 pm:
Have many of you guys had cracking problems with the Chinese Ebay manifolds? The only problem I read is fitment that put people off them.
Me... It took about 10,000km, but it happened.
Also for dumps why run steam pipe? No Need. Turbo manifold, Yes, but exhaust no.
6 boost use steam pipe, as turbo manifolds can be exposed to big pressure. Especially when anti lag is used. 6 boost also have great welding and warrant their products.
Your welds DO look shonky, and with the expanding and contracting of the metal when your turbos are hot, those welds will eventually crack. It may not happen in 1000km, but by the time you have 5000km on them there will be more leaks than the titanic.
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