| Author |
Message |
Damian Ware
TryHard
Victoria
UZZ32
Posts: 362
Reg: 10-2005
|
Yep I know and I would get one if I could. |
Mark Paddick
Goo Roo
ACT
UZZ31 V8 Soarer , JZZ30 TT Soarer
Posts: 3024
Reg: 07-2005
|
I've only seen one series two V8 Mines.
It cost me the A/C compressor as it didn't seem to like the shift-kitted change into third at the 7500 limit (or thereabouts, I'm not real sure) that particular ECU had.
The 4-Runner has certainly been done before. I've wired 2 of 'em. each took me less than a day to get going and mostly sorted.
It doesn't really matter what model V8 goes into them. Even a tired old one will make it sit up and beg!
If you get an engine/gearbox with the wiring harness attached and not cut as well as the ECU it just about falls in and does it itself.
The VVTi later models need a fair bit more work and are less easy.
My old engine would be perfect with it's good gearbox but I think it may be down a bit on compression, I won't check it 'til it comes out and that way it'll be OK  |
Ashley Leach
TryHard
South Australia
Soarer GT Limited UZZ31 V8
Posts: 401
Reg: 02-2006
|
Well we have a 5 speed supra with the conversion kit and heavy duty clutch, loom & flywheel etc. Just need a decent engine to bolt it on to.
When you check out your old engine let me know what its like. I've managed to source a 92 V8 but I'm not really sure if it's in good condition. The guy wants $1800 for the engine kit. The two ECU's and engines we have look like they are from a Crown, not a soarer, very different headers etc.
How do you test compression anyway? |
Mark Paddick
Goo Roo
ACT
UZZ31 V8 Soarer , JZZ30 TT Soarer
Posts: 3034
Reg: 07-2005
|
Compression test is easy. Remove the spark plug and fit the gauge and then wind the motor over.
Mine will want rings for sure I reckon. Top end is quiet and clean but the engine feels down on power like it's down on compression all round. Doesn't use oil to any degree and drives well. |
Ashley Leach
TryHard
South Australia
Soarer GT Limited UZZ31 V8
Posts: 405
Reg: 02-2006
|
Let me know when your ready to sell it and what you want for it. Some pic will be good.
Found out that my ticking is coming from my injectors (a quick inspection with a screwdriver tonight has confirmed it)
Now I just have to figure out what to do about it. How much will a new set put me out? Or should I just steal the best sets of those other two 1UZ's? |
Mark Paddick
Goo Roo
ACT
UZZ31 V8 Soarer , JZZ30 TT Soarer
Posts: 3037
Reg: 07-2005
|
Injectors are always a little that way inclined. Sometimes a real good clean can sort them.
I'd pinch 'em off the others, clean 'em and see how it goes, can't lose too much.
Of course one alternative is to say to yourself "Gee, that's great, the camtrain isn't noisy at all. It's only injector noise and all EFI cars have that. Let's go get a beer instead !" or words to that effect 
If engine and gearbox ECU's are separate the Crown is the probable source I think.
Mine will come with harness and ECU but not gearbox at this stage unless you want a 5spd auto. (not sure which ECU yet either, it will be a Soarer one but not Mines as I don't have one anymore. Could be a US one if I don't need it elsewhere. Either way it'll be a rebuilt one).
With a bit of luck it may just jump out over Christmas if my mate gets his damn hoist put back up soon. |
Ashley Leach
TryHard
South Australia
Soarer GT Limited UZZ31 V8
Posts: 409
Reg: 02-2006
|
True, I'm going to steal them tomorrow and find somewhere to clean them, I'll probably just swap them over to see if that makes any difference first and get my original ones cleaned. Best thing is I can steal the whole fuel rail.
I wont need the gearbox, unless I feel like dropping it into my Soarer. So a US ECU? Well if it's that one I'll swap it for mine, I'd rather a US ECU (no speed cut) anyway and what do you mean by "rebuilt"
PM me when your ready and have sorted it out, I don't think there's any real rush. We just want to start something early next year. |
Mark Paddick
Goo Roo
ACT
UZZ31 V8 Soarer , JZZ30 TT Soarer
Posts: 3047
Reg: 07-2005
|
I totally re-solder the ECUs and replace all the capacitors and any other known failure candidates.
Takes about 3 or 4 hours plus testing, this fixes all the common faults and guarantees that it will work for a few more years at least. Every Toyota (and most others too) ECU is FULL of dry joints and bad soldering.
It's not just Toyota and it's not just ECUs. Every piece of electronics has soldering problems to some degree. This is because of the way that they are built using mass soldering techniques. Even the factory knows it's not good as you can see certain areas of ECU boards that were re-soldered by hand in the factory. They don't bother going over them by hand for non-critical stuff just the ECus and a few other bits they deem critical. After a few years ALL solder joints start to deteriorate. Only the real old radios from early last century have solder that is still OK in some cases. This is because they were hand soldered in the first place and the solder was thick, flux impregnated stuff that absorbed the flux properly.
These days with environmentally friendly solder and fluxes applied by machine it doesn't work so well and the flux leaches out of the solder making it dry and crumbly after a while.
15 years is more than too long for that kind of effort to last.
The Yank ECU is still sitting in my shed. I have had it running and need to sort out a couple of alarms but it's great. Slightly higher rev limit too and it does make the engine go a little harder. (US spec engines had a little extra power ???).
It may need extra wide band oxygen sensors if I can't fool it into thinking that they are already there. The Yank cars all have 4 wideband sensors.
(this is what part of the blank bit of the ECU main board is for if you look at a Jap ECU. The US boards have lots of little bits in that part of the board). |
Ashley Leach
TryHard
South Australia
Soarer GT Limited UZZ31 V8
Posts: 412
Reg: 02-2006
|
Hmmm, well that all sounds very good with the US ECU, sounds better made.
I was thinking that if the ECU died I'd just try to replace it with a Mines, Blitz or TOM's if I could find one. I like the idea of Harry's ECU, but they are as rare as hens teeth or so I hear. I think Neil has one, but he wasn't a replacement as well as cash, and I'd rather keep the stock, just in case something happens. |
Mark Paddick
Goo Roo
ACT
UZZ31 V8 Soarer , JZZ30 TT Soarer
Posts: 3052
Reg: 07-2005
|
All the above are good but all except the Mines series two (and then only the main board, the other one is still Toyota factory) and the TOMS (which is totally custom) are based on an original factory ECU which is getting old and all the soldering problems are still there. This is why just getting one from a wreck is no longer a real good idea. A lot of them are still going fine but quite a few have unnoticed or undiagnosed problems and a lot are already dead.
Mostly they are fixable but not always. (put the right two different diagnostic links in at once and the ECU is dead forever).
The cost of fixing them is more than the cost of a 2nd hand replacement but the 2nd hand jobbie may not last too long and will definitely fail eventually.
The US ECUs are identical to the Jap ones. All the boards are exactly the same. the US one has some extra parts fitted, 4 oxy sensors, EGR valve control etc and some of the Jap bits missing.
The US ECU seems to have a little more aggressive timing maps and slightly higher rev limit (6400 or 6600, can't remember) as well as no speed cut.
The main reason for the differences, however, was to meet the Californian emission laws.
All my ECUs have been rebuilt. |
Nik Peacock
Tinkerer
Tasmania
V8 GTL
Posts: 25
Reg: 05-2006
|
Mark,is it possible to source a US ecu and have you do any necessary mods/fixes, what do you think that would cost, is this a good option or would I be better off with a mines, blitz etc. The big issue I have is the speed limit, would rather have a complete fix rather than trickery with a RSM, some extra RPM and timing would also be very nice |
Ashley Leach
TryHard
South Australia
Soarer GT Limited UZZ31 V8
Posts: 413
Reg: 02-2006
|
Well I'm the same really. I'd rather a firmly built ECU, even if it's fixed, than something that's going to die on me.
Chances are then that most ECU's have some kind of problem with them. So what does it take to have the re-built? How much are we looking at etc? Obviously I'll need a second unit to run the car while the other one is being re-built. |
Mark Paddick
Goo Roo
ACT
UZZ31 V8 Soarer , JZZ30 TT Soarer
Posts: 3056
Reg: 07-2005
|
$350 up front and $150 returned when the old ECU comes back.
TT's are a bit cheaper 'cos they're not as complex and easier to do.
The US ECU's are relatively easy and cheap to get $200 or so should get one (I paid $50 at auction).
If you got the loom and all the bits that plug into it (O2 sensors and all the rest) it'll plug in and go. Some pins aren't used in the Jap ECU and vice versa so the wires aren't in the loom.
It'd be easier to get the US loom, exhaust manifolds and all the sensors. |
Nik Peacock
Tinkerer
Tasmania
V8 GTL
Posts: 26
Reg: 05-2006
|
I have the magnificent rush headers so don't want to go back to original manifolds, sounds like we might have to wait for Neil's plug and play option, hope it comes soon the speed limit is driving me insane  |
Ashley Leach
TryHard
South Australia
Soarer GT Limited UZZ31 V8
Posts: 415
Reg: 02-2006
|
Yes I have them as well 1 3/4" Ceramic Coated... Oh so good. |
Mark Paddick
Goo Roo
ACT
UZZ31 V8 Soarer , JZZ30 TT Soarer
Posts: 3059
Reg: 07-2005
|
Fitting extra O2 sensors is no trouble with or without the extractors. One pair is already catered for on the extractors. The second pair go after the catalytic converters. Simple as drilling a hole in the exhaust pipe just after the cat and welding a nut on. It may be possible to fool the ECU by modifying the signals from one pair of sensors though. They may well have to be wideband types which the Soarer ones are not but the Yank ones all are. New wideband sensors are not cheap in batches of four or even just two.
Hence the suggestion to get them with the ECU as they will be cheaper that way. The manifolds, loom and cats would make it all just bolt-on but are not necessary as such.
As yet I just haven't had the time to play with it. The ECU itself can be modified to use the Soarer loom and hopefully only two O2 sensors and also to ignore the absence of an EGR valve. What other sensors may or may not need modifying I won't know 'til the O2 sensor alarms are gone.
As it is the SC400 ECU will run with no mods in a Soarer but gets an engine electrical alarm after a few minutes which is annoying. It probably then does not work as well and is in some sort of fail-safe or limp mode but it still drives OK. |
Ashley Leach
TryHard
South Australia
Soarer GT Limited UZZ31 V8
Posts: 417
Reg: 02-2006
|
If I was headed down that path I'd probably replace the O2 sensors anyway, weather they would be wide band would depend on the ECU. I'm sure are 15+ years the O2 sensors aren't in the best condition anyway.
So the just the US ECU isn't a direct plug in then, some modification is required either to the loom or O2 sensors unless you have them. Wouldn't you be better off with an after market ECU then?
I'll just be so happy if the tick that I have is fixed by the injector's getting cleaned. (Anyone know where there is a place in Adelaide that does it? I can't find anywhere) |
Mark Paddick
Goo Roo
ACT
UZZ31 V8 Soarer , JZZ30 TT Soarer
Posts: 3068
Reg: 07-2005
|
Some internal mods to the Yank ECU should get it working as a direct plug-in. It is a HEAP cheaper to go this way BUT you still have a locked tight ECU be it a bit better one. $200 or less for the ECU and maybe $250 to $300 for a complete resolder and cap replacement and the necessary mods to EGR and O2 circuits and it's still half the cost of a Mines and plug'n'play so no added tuning costs (like a Mines). Two wideband O2 sensors (and simulate the missing two) and it's all done and still under the cost of any aftermarket solution and it may not need the new sensors.
It's not going to be a worldbeater but it'll go faster than a standard Soarer. |
Ashley Leach
TryHard
South Australia
Soarer GT Limited UZZ31 V8
Posts: 421
Reg: 02-2006
|
It's a shame the after market ECU's are so much of a pain to get hold of, and expensive.
So where should I start looking for a US ECU or are there still more than one Harry's floating about? |
Mark Paddick
Goo Roo
ACT
UZZ31 V8 Soarer , JZZ30 TT Soarer
Posts: 3085
Reg: 07-2005
|
US ebay is a good start. There is a place there who say they have ECU's for anything for a flat US$200. That would be easy a relatively painless but you can do better for price. Quite a few wreckers have stuff on eBay all the time.
Be careful that you get the right one. ECU's changed several times over the years and some are totally different.
For a '91 to about '93 or 4 1UZFE the correct US ECU is 89661-24230 and has a large black 30 on the label. |
Ashley Leach
TryHard
South Australia
Soarer GT Limited UZZ31 V8
Posts: 425
Reg: 02-2006
|
Something like this?
But for $200US they can bash it up their bums. I mean come on, it's technically not even directly interchangeable and you'd be better off getting a Mines, Blitz, TOM's or Harry's for tha price.
Anyway looks like the shims are definably a doable thing on the engine, it would probably a good time to replace the rocker cover gasket at the same time while your at it. |
Mark Paddick
Goo Roo
ACT
UZZ31 V8 Soarer , JZZ30 TT Soarer
Posts: 3239
Reg: 07-2005
|
That is the one. if you want cheap that is it.
It's near enough interchangeable and will run OK anyway without any mods.
For about $500 to $600 all up with the mods needed it's not too bad in an area with limited options at less than half price of one of the good Mines. Even the early V8 Mines will go for $1000.
Harry's ECU which is a Mines clone with extras was $1200.
There's a few Blitz and the odd others around but not much else. None are cheap.
And Nobody's ever seen a V8 TOMS but apparently they did make some.
And that's it except for a piggyback stockie which won't have rev or speed cuts lifted unless the piggy back takes over control and the stock ECU just does the gearbox and then it's not really a piggy back and takes as much tuning as a full standalone at $200 an hour for a couple of days.
Unless you've got the money don't even think about a standalone.
Even a cheap one at under a $1000 is going to cost you to tune it and will certainly cost more than bolting an untunable and therefore un-having-to-pay-for-the-tune, Mines series two at $1200 starting prices.
The Mines will definitely wake it up and will work.
The US ECU will too but won't wake it up much but it will some. For the increase in revs and no speed cut $500 is good value in V8 Toyota world.
(Better value for me at $130 but the I got one cheap and I don't have to pay me to mod it).
It's not that more than a good speed cut defender and gives you a few revs and a bit of timing too.
Nothing else comes near it for the price.
Me, I'm going Autronic or Motec unless I can find something else that can drive all the bits I need driven but there aren't many that can.
I expect that to cost at least $2000 up front and probably the same again over six months or so to tune it. |
Ashley Leach
TryHard
South Australia
Soarer GT Limited UZZ31 V8
Posts: 426
Reg: 02-2006
|
Well I hope your happy with the work for that price.
I like the concept of Harry's ECU, PnP with that cool little switch that changes the rev limits etc. I't just a shame that they were so expensive and rare. Can you get harry to make some series 2?
Even getting a stand alone tuned you can get a UNICHIP at the same time and have it all tuned up? |
Mark Paddick
Goo Roo
ACT
UZZ31 V8 Soarer , JZZ30 TT Soarer
Posts: 3242
Reg: 07-2005
|
Series one that Harry did could be done easy enough.
He would have all the board designs and part numbers and where to get •••• information.
I don't think it's worth his time and I know how he feels!
It's a bit like Stackers, Bastards to work on and get right.
Don't make enough (or any) profit to be worth doing.
And I have mine and it works and I don't really care about the others. Got a spare too but ain't sellin'
I'm sure Harry has an ECU in his car.
It could be done but I'm not sure I want to be involved and i don't think Harry does either.
Partly it's the experience of having 'been there done that'.
I have all sorts of bits for these cars, not all will suit mine, that I have researched, imported, modified and sorted out.
Nobody will buy them off me.
Yet everyone said "Yay, I WANT one of those!!! Get me one. Get me one" when first mentioned.
What they neglected to say was "I want it NOW. It has to be the best available. And I don't want to pay for it."
So maybe it could be done. It may even work out cheaper. but a quite a few would have to "Put up or Shut up" (and that means CASH. In advance) before it could ever happen.
I would do it but not for free. |
Nik Peacock
Tinkerer
Tasmania
V8 GTL
Posts: 27
Reg: 05-2006
|
from following this thread it sounds like Neil's soon to be coming ECU's will do what Harry's does, cut speed limit, increase rev limit, advance timing, modify fuel maps. If that's the case, and please correct me if i'm wrong, probably worth waiting for one of those, does everything that most members seem to want and a simple plug and play, I don't think that it matters how much it costs so long as it is a simple install an gives results to the never ending quest for more power |
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