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  Soarer Central * Mechanical - V8 * Higher temp than normal thermostat for a V8 * Archive through August 23, 2013 Previous Previous    Next Next  

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John Stafford
DieHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 545
Reg: 02-2010

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Friday, August 16, 2013 - 05:51 pm, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I am looking for a higher than standard 82 degree temp thermostat for my 32. Can anyone help?
Thanks in advance.
Robert Day
DieHard
victoria
v8 & TT

Posts: 587
Reg: 01-2007

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Friday, August 16, 2013 - 06:36 pm, by:  Robert Day (Lexsmaz) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Its up to you, but why would you want a higher temp thermostat ..
John Stafford
DieHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 546
Reg: 02-2010

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Saturday, August 17, 2013 - 05:01 am, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have fitted a mod that drops my temp by 25 degrees and want to keep the engine warm.
Tom Richards
Goo Roo
nsw
V8

Posts: 1640
Reg: 08-2005

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Saturday, August 17, 2013 - 07:01 am, by:  Tom Richards (Tomr) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

what is the mod?
Blake Gloyn
Goo Roo
manawatu
soarer JZZ30 TT

Posts: 1012
Reg: 02-2006

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Saturday, August 17, 2013 - 08:55 am, by:  Blake Gloyn (Blakenz) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

25 degrees!!!!! that is astounding, John! can you tell us, or is it commercially sensitive? :-)
Boris Siljanoski
Goo Roo
Western Australia
LS400 + Soarer.

Posts: 2080
Reg: 11-2007

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Saturday, August 17, 2013 - 11:03 am, by:  Boris Siljanoski (Z2tt) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Explain why you want to have the thermostat open at a higher temperature than factory, the engine is more likely to overheat.
John Stafford
DieHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 548
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Saturday, August 17, 2013 - 01:40 pm, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi Guys, Amazing hey?
It is a secret at the moment but I am sure if it works I will have some customers
I need a little more time till I break the news, if I succeed. Not a bad inter-cooler hey?
It is normal to ask why I want it hotter when the normal is to want it cooler, you will just have to hang onto your seats.

I will let you know but in the mean time; does anyone know if there is a hotter thermostat.
Cheers John
Mark Donovan
DieHard
Auckland
V8 Limited

Posts: 853
Reg: 07-2005

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Saturday, August 17, 2013 - 05:00 pm, by:  Mark Donovan (Mark_donovan) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I thought the TRD thermostats were rated to higher temps?
Blake Gloyn
Goo Roo
manawatu
soarer JZZ30 TT

Posts: 1013
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Saturday, August 17, 2013 - 06:23 pm, by:  Blake Gloyn (Blakenz) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

No Mark, lower normally. they are rated to open at lower temps. Doesn't always mean that the water will run cooler though.
Dave Rose
Goo Roo
wa
UZZ31 / ML320 CDI

Posts: 2340
Reg: 03-2007

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Saturday, August 17, 2013 - 06:43 pm, by:  Dave Rose (Sand_groper) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

water or steam injection?? perhaps
John Stafford
DieHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 551
Reg: 02-2010

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Saturday, August 17, 2013 - 07:44 pm, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes, I heard from Toyota that there was a 79 degree one, but haven't discovered a hotter one yet. I don't think there is one.

Like Blake said: that doesn't mean the engine will run cooler though.

Dave, I will let the crew know when I have the results that I am looking for: More economy and more power.
David Henderson
TryHard
Nsw
TT

Posts: 354
Reg: 08-2007

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Monday, August 19, 2013 - 10:00 pm, by:  David Henderson (Hendo) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

keep in mind the engines are designed on tolerances of metals at specified temperatures, deviating from this will cause problems, such as fuel dilution in oil not being evaporated when the oil gets up to temp or piston slap
John Stafford
DieHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 558
Reg: 02-2010

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Monday, August 19, 2013 - 10:56 pm, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

yes David, I want to maintain around 90 degrees constant temp. I am putting a new thermostat in the car (82 degrees), standard Toyota 1UZ thermo, hoping that I will be able to maintain at least that temp. I will see how it goes and will let you know the outcome.
Robert Day
DieHard
victoria
v8 & TT

Posts: 594
Reg: 01-2007

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Monday, August 19, 2013 - 11:07 pm, by:  Robert Day (Lexsmaz) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I don't really understand the concept, as you say you are aiming for around 90 degrees engine temp, yet you say you can drop the temp by 25 degrees, unless this is being used under constant full load, I don't see the advantages & so it sounds like the radiator is where the extra cooling is gained & in the end the thermostat is just going to be cycling slightly open then closed a lot more than normal in my eyes ..
John Stafford
DieHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 559
Reg: 02-2010

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Tuesday, August 20, 2013 - 07:23 am, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

With what I have done, the temp has dropped by 25 degrees as a result of a colder injection temp, this has in turn dropped the overall temp of the engine to 56 degrees, far below the proper operating temp of an engine, which should be about 90 degrees to get the best economy and to conform to what David says is the right operating temp for these engines.
My problem must be that my thermostat is not closing properly, I haven't taken it out and tested it yet, but the problem seems obvious, so I need a new thermostat but it would be better if I could get a slightly hotter one, say 85 degrees, so that it would make it easier to maintain a higher operating temp. seeing as the thermo would not even open until the engine was up to the temp that gives best economy and engine life.
My fuel intake area will still be only just warm/cool to touch on a full operation temp engine, a bit like running dry ice on an intercooler for drag racing.

The colder our air intake is the better the power, right? And so my aim is more economy and more power at that same time.

I am sure that this system will be of interest to those running turbos and fighting to keep their air temp down. Also to any who run full throttle on the track and need to keep temp under control.

More to come, but I need to put new oxy sensors in and get that new thermostat in first, then I will report on my progress, I hope
John Stafford
DieHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 560
Reg: 02-2010

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Tuesday, August 20, 2013 - 07:33 am, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Oh, another question while we are at it:
Has anyone successfully put a resister in the IAT (Intake Air temp) sensor wire to give more timing to the engine. I think that the Apexi devise does this but that is an extra expense, how about someone just putting a pot in there or is that not possible with the type of MAF that the V8s have?

I want some more timing without going to the expense of a different ECU or an Apexi.

Any way to get another say 5 degrees advance?
Tom Richards
Goo Roo
nsw
V8

Posts: 1651
Reg: 08-2005

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Tuesday, August 20, 2013 - 08:51 am, by:  Tom Richards (Tomr) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i would guess you are playing around with water injection. ( I used it back in the late 60's, very basic (a needle put thru the carby throat and connected to a water bottle. A clamp on the tube enabled the flow to be adjusted. the air rushing past the tip of the needle provided the suction to pull the water thru)t but seemed to give more power and better economy)

To get the benefits, you need to advance the timing, which you are trying to achieve, and also lean out the fuel mixture. How will you lean out the fuel with the standard ecu?
John Stafford
DieHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 562
Reg: 02-2010

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Tuesday, August 20, 2013 - 09:51 am, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Tom, the system that I am using is much more technical that the basic idea of water feed. I used to have one of these units (a "misty") that I purchased in Sydney in 1978 and fitted to my Datsun skyline 2.4 ltr six cylinder overhead cam engine, great car, 2 door with a great independent rear end, very state of the art in those days. Loved that car on twisty roads.

I got about 2 more miles per gallon and maybe a little more power, not much difference.

This system that I am now working with has a way of helping keep the fuel as lean as possible, I would just like to get some more timing in there without spending the extra money on an after market ECU.

I may well fit LPG injection to it as well when I get it sorted, which will give me control over the amount of LPG that goes in via the LPG computer. I have learned a fair bit about how to get the right amounts of LPG in there at the right revs by experimenting on my 31 which I put vapour injection on a couple of years ago. It now has more power than on petrol.
The installer was not sufficiently conversant with performance vehicles, or driving, to know just how to fix my problems with getting both power and economy out of the system at the same time, and there was no one on the net that I could find that would give any info away. It seemed like a closed book. One gury would tune in on a dyno for me for just under $300 labour. It took me lots of experimenting to find out how to get what I was looking for but I have it pretty good now.
Power when I want it and economy when cruising.

My running cost is about half what it would cost on 98 octane and more power than you get on petrol. I would like to give my 31 more timing too, to increase both economy and power.

Any advise from you Tom, or from anyone else coming in on this chat?
Scott Vim
DieHard
Vic
Soarer (1uz) Chaser (1jz)

Posts: 722
Reg: 12-2010

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Tuesday, August 20, 2013 - 10:50 am, by:  Scott Vim (1uz1jz) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thought water injection was either too pricey or too unreliable.
My intake temps are crazy. M90.
Tom Richards
Goo Roo
nsw
V8

Posts: 1652
Reg: 08-2005

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Tuesday, August 20, 2013 - 11:04 am, by:  Tom Richards (Tomr) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

sorry John, i cannot offer any possible solutions.
John Stafford
DieHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 564
Reg: 02-2010

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Tuesday, August 20, 2013 - 12:21 pm, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Scott, this is not any normal system that most would be familiar with. This is pricey but looks at the moment that it is worth it but haven't finished with it yet.

I just found that I need a water inlet (plastic from the lower radiator hose to the thermostat. It is the plastic spout that goes over the thermostat). Mine is in disrepair. Anyone got one?
Boris Siljanoski
Goo Roo
Western Australia
LS400 + Soarer.

Posts: 2088
Reg: 11-2007

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Tuesday, August 20, 2013 - 09:04 pm, by:  Boris Siljanoski (Z2tt) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Putting a Resister on the IAT Sensor is dangerous as the ECU Knows what is the safe timing for the current IAT.

You are best to get a standalone ECU instead of tricking the ECU to get false readings as you don't have much control over your timing that way.
John Stafford
DieHard
Qld.
Soarer UZZ31 GT-L V8 and a UZZ32 # 514

Posts: 570
Reg: 02-2010

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Wednesday, August 21, 2013 - 08:35 am, by:  John Stafford (Johng12) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes, that is the problem with OBD 1, you can't see what is happening inside the engine like OBD 2.
Thanks for the advise.
Cihan Aday
Newbie
Etuner.com.au New Website & Forum
JZZ30

Posts: 3336
Reg: 07-2005

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Friday, August 23, 2013 - 12:25 pm, by:  Cihan Aday (Cihan) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

John, the Snap-on Ethos scan tool reads Toyota 'ODB' no problem. I use it when tuning to get consistent results, to sort out fuel trim issues with piggyback's and to reference timing ;-)

Regarding the topic - bit odd to use a higher temp thermostat :-)

From my limited experience - small plan engines run real cold (40-60 degrees) but tend to use mono weight oil around SAE 50w and i'd assume 60's style oil clearance.
Blake Gloyn
Goo Roo
manawatu
soarer JZZ30 TT

Posts: 1014
Reg: 02-2006

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Friday, August 23, 2013 - 07:44 pm, by:  Blake Gloyn (Blakenz) Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

And there it is boys, a now rare post from one of our most valued JZ buddies. Good to hear from you Cihan. We have missed you.

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