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David Goldthorpe
TryHard
NSW
UZZ31 GT-L

Posts: 111
Reg: 11-2007

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Monday, February 16, 2009 - 09:05 pm, by:  David Goldthorpe (Sprocket82) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yesterday morning I noticed when I got into the car my brake pressure was so low, I could easily press the pedal into the floor. After starting the engine and pumping the pedal a few times, it was back to normal. I've had the same problem every time I drive it since.
After searching the archives, I couldn't see that anyone else has had this exact problem. Is it a problem with the master cylinder or nitrogen accumulator? I have ABS and TRAC. Reservoir fluid level is fine. Can't see any leaks anywhere.

Any help appreciated.
Thanks.
Matthew Sharpe
Goo Roo
North Island
JZZ31

Posts: 4109
Reg: 10-2005

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Tuesday, February 17, 2009 - 06:14 am, by:  Matthew Sharpe (Madmatt) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

If you aren't losing fluid it sounds like the accumulator.
Dave Hart
Goo Roo
Waikato
UZZ32

Posts: 1369
Reg: 08-2005

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Tuesday, February 17, 2009 - 10:37 am, by:  Dave Hart (Davyboy) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Also if you're not sure when the brake fluid was last changed, get that done.
David Goldthorpe
TryHard
NSW
UZZ31 GT-L

Posts: 112
Reg: 11-2007

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Monday, February 23, 2009 - 05:26 pm, by:  David Goldthorpe (Sprocket82) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was thinking accumulator, too. I've just removed it from the car and going to try and get it regassed this week. Has anyone in the Newcastle area done this before?
I went and asked at Kawasaki (Broadmeadow) and the mechanic there was keen do it for me until he saw the car and said he didn't want anything to do with a grey import. He then sent me around the corner to Brett Thomas who specialises in Jaguars. He seems like a decent bloke but not able to do the re-gas himself so I'm wondering who in Newcastle can? I'll try Frasers tomorrow and a few others.

Cheers.
Dave Hart
Goo Roo
Waikato
UZZ32

Posts: 1372
Reg: 08-2005

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Monday, February 23, 2009 - 06:10 pm, by:  Dave Hart (Davyboy) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I would think it was low accumulator pressure only if the pump was running every few seconds. If the pump only runs occasionally then the accumulator pressure will be fine.
The brakes may just need bleeding.
How easy was it removing the accumulator?
David Goldthorpe
TryHard
NSW
UZZ31 GT-L

Posts: 113
Reg: 11-2007

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Monday, February 23, 2009 - 07:37 pm, by:  David Goldthorpe (Sprocket82) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The pump runs for about 20-30 seconds when I start the car but if I then press hard on the pedal it starts up again.
To remove the accumulator, I just pumped the pedal about 30 times until there was a noticeable pressure build up and used an oil filter remover to loosen it easily.
Dave Hart
Goo Roo
Waikato
UZZ32

Posts: 1374
Reg: 08-2005

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Monday, February 23, 2009 - 09:04 pm, by:  Dave Hart (Davyboy) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It's usual for the pump to run for 30 secs or so on start up and to run again whenever the brakes are applied. If it runs often whilst just driving or idling without applying the brakes then it's low in nitrogen.
So when you loosened off the accumulator there was no escape of pressure, oil or gas?
David Goldthorpe
TryHard
NSW
UZZ31 GT-L

Posts: 114
Reg: 11-2007

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Monday, February 23, 2009 - 10:47 pm, by:  David Goldthorpe (Sprocket82) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

No, nothing at all.
Steve Latimer
TryHard
VIC
UZZ32

Posts: 274
Reg: 07-2005

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Monday, February 23, 2009 - 11:31 pm, by:  Steve Latimer (Latsus) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

David Goldthorpe:

email sent

Dave Rose
DieHard
wa
uzz31 v8

Posts: 772
Reg: 03-2007

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Tuesday, February 24, 2009 - 09:04 am, by:  Dave Rose (Sand_groper) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think its just air in the system ,just needs a bleed?
David Goldthorpe
TryHard
NSW
UZZ31 GT-L

Posts: 115
Reg: 11-2007

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Tuesday, February 24, 2009 - 11:42 pm, by:  David Goldthorpe (Sprocket82) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks for the advise Dave, I will try that on the weekend.

Went to Fraser Motorcycles today and their machine only does 300 PSI anyway so not enough for the accumulator.

Email received, Steve. Will let you know if I need one, Thanks.
David Goldthorpe
TryHard
NSW
UZZ31 GT-L

Posts: 116
Reg: 11-2007

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Sunday, March 01, 2009 - 04:35 pm, by:  David Goldthorpe (Sprocket82) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Bled the rear brakes thisafternoon and it appears you were correct, Dave R, there was air in the system. Didn't notice any in the left side, just a bit of reddish muck that came out initially (rust?). The photos below show the small air bubbles I was getting from the right bleed nipple.


Upload

Upload


Funny thing is, these didn't appear until after I had pumped the brake pedal about 15 times, not whilst I was doing it. I then sat there next to the car and watched them pour out for about 2 minutes, even though no more brake fluid was being expelled.
The other alarming thing is, as I was pumping the pedal, I noticed air bubbles rising in the fluid reservoir as the pedal was released. I didn't bother doing the front brakes because I thought this is something that maybe needs more than just a bleed to fix but correct me if I'm wrong.
I topped the reservoir up with Castrol Response Super Dot 4 as I was going. Here's a photo of the drained fluid:

Upload


Any help appreciated.

Thanks.
Dave Hart
Goo Roo
Waikato
UZZ32

Posts: 1381
Reg: 08-2005

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Sunday, March 01, 2009 - 06:21 pm, by:  Dave Hart (Davyboy) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

There's a special procedure for bleeding the brakes in a ABS system. Best to get it done right otherwise you might end up against something other than the road.
Matthew Sharpe
Goo Roo
North Island
JZZ31

Posts: 4151
Reg: 10-2005

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Monday, March 02, 2009 - 11:25 am, by:  Matthew Sharpe (Madmatt) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Fluid is very dark and gunky looking, so definitely needed changing.
Peter Nitschke
Junk Filterer
South Australia
UZZ30 UZZ31

Posts: 10435
Reg: 11-2004

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Tuesday, March 03, 2009 - 03:44 am, by:  Peter Nitschke (Pen) Quote hilighted text Edit Post Delete Post Print Post   View Post/Check IP (Moderator/Admin Only) Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Let the old fluid sit for a while and the gunk should settle out after a week or two. Then shake it, and see how long it takes to settle after that. My experience is that it probably won't settle after a shake!

Suggest find an empty bit of gravel road and test the ABS a few times, then bleed again, as using the ABS should pump some of the old fluid and possibly air from it.

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